PREFACE
It was just for fun when I first opened my
Face Book account in the beginning of this year (2012). Very soon I found that
it is a very powerful machine to make social networking on any subject with
anybody in the world without any discrimination of race, color & creed.
Being a man of very religious minded, I started participating on religious
discussion with many people of different languages. At one stage I found that
the most debatable religion of the world is Christianity. Different people
& cult has interpreted the sayings of Jesus as per their own understanding
& developed different types of Doctrines in support to their opinion. Some
Doctrines were developed to explain the miraculous birth of Jesus without a
father. Some were developed to justify the crucifixion of Jesus. Another problem was with the translations of
Bible in different languages. With the absent of original script, people started
putting their own ideas while making translations. This also gave rise to
different doctrines.
The first interaction I had was with The
Evangelistic Ministry of AladesanmiAdeyemi from Frankfurt. We had a long series
of dialogues with them on different topics of Christianity. Those who have
followed us on face book know what we have talked about. But for others, I
thought I should compose & publish the whole strings as an e-book. I have
put them in Part-I in this book.
At one stage, The Evangelistic Ministry
stopped replying my mails. I had to find an alternative. Fortunately I found
another organization named godlife.com who agreed to have dialogue with me, but
only on email. I agreed to their proposal & started our dialogue. This
time, it was very long conversation with Mr. Donald of godlife.com & we
touched upon almost every chapters of Bible.
They are put in Part-II of this book.
This book is mainly intended for our Christian
friends. However, The Muslims who wants to have dialogues with Christians may
find lot of materials in this book. I will be happy if anybody irrespective of
religions be benefited with this book. May God guide us to the real truth.
This book is free & open for everybody.
Anybody may copy, re-print or translate, any part or whole of it, any time
without my permission.
I thank my youngest brother RezaurRahman for
making all arrangements to compose, edit & publish this e-book. May Allah
swt accept this efforts& guide us.
M KHALILUR RAHMAN
07 August, 2012
Khalil@optimaxbd.net
Dhaka, Bangladesh
God himself testified to it in Old and the New Testament that
Jesus is his Son. The Quran testified to it that Jesus is Messiah and was born
without Father which is unique. Some claimed that because God could say let
there be and there will be, so Jesus could not have been the son of God. God
did not create human being like the way he created animal. So for Jesus to be
without human father then God must have been his father
February
19 at 11:56pm · Like
God created Adam without father & mother.
Even present day science can make a man without father. They take a tissue
& produce a clone of any animal. An ovum of a mother can be artificially
fertilized in a Lab even without man's sperm. So, it is very much possible for
Almighty God to fertilize the ovum of Marry in her womb without any man's
sperm. So, it is not required that God should become a physical father of Jesus
for his birth. Science has made it very easy to justify our religion. In fact
all faithful are the Son of God. Jesus said-" who so ever have faith on
Jesus, he is the Son of God" (John 1:12)
March 4
at 9:13am · Like
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@ Rahman: No doctor can produce a child without the sperm of a man. To clone any animal you need
the DNA of the same animal. Any male child needs a Y Chromosome from the
father. Jesus is a male child. For him to have a Y chromosome, God
must have created it newly. This probably suggest that Jesus did not have
the DNA of Mary. He has been in existence ever coming to Mary's womb. Jesus
became the son of God when he took on the human body. He had been equal with
God in eternity. Science even made your religion worst. There is no salvation
outside Christ. You can be a son of God by receiving Christ into your life.
This kind of son ship is based on love of God.
March 4
at 11:20pm · Like
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Outside Christianity, we are the only Nation
in this world who believes Jesus was born miraculously without a father. Let us
not argue how it is done. God made him like this. God created Adam also without
a father & mother. It does not mean that God is the father &
mother of Adam. Miracles does not make a Prophet equal to God. Moses could make
a living snake out of a dead stick. It does not make him God. So, without going
for any assumption, you must follow what Jesus said in the book of Mathew,
Mark, John & Luke. Jesus never said..." I am God & worship
me"
March 5
at 8:11am · Like
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Jesus was not equal to God because he worked miracle. He was
equal to God because he has been in existence before his birth and does share
the same glory with God. The same Jesus is the same yesterday, today and
forever. Jesus categorically said he came from heaven. Jesus is the only human
ever lived that came directly from heaven to this earth. After his
resurrection, he went back to heaven again. All the Old Testament prophets
testified of him. The angel proclaimed him. Jesus is not just like any other
human that has ever lived. No! Jesus is God becoming man. Think about it, since
Jesus said he came from heaven. Who do you think that he is - an Angel? People
do worship him in the books of Gospel. He did not come to be served but to
serve and to save. This was his assignment. That's why he did not go on
demanding worship from people. The people then did not believe him, so why need
of asking them to worship him. Those who believe him did worship him
March 5
at 2:31pm · Like
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Jesus did not come direct from heaven.
He has to come through the womb of Mary just like any other person. Only Adam
came direct from heaven. But Adam never claimed that he is God. What is your
belief about Jesus coming back again physically to this earth & preaching
religion again?
March 5
at 6:24pm · Like
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Jesus is not coming again to preach religion. he is coming to
reign and to judge. Then he will demand worship
March 5
at 7:36pm · Like
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You mean He is coming to this world
physically. But how he will come? He will come direct from the sky or he will
born again without a father or how & where & when?
March 5
at 10:21pm · Like
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Yes, he will come physically just the way he went through
the sky
March 5
at 11:05pm · Like
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So, your belief & our belief regarding
coming back of Jesus is similar. He is taken up physically & he will come
down also physically. But our Prophet gave some more specific description about
Jesus. He will land on the Minar( Tower) of a mosque East of Damascus.
People will recognize him as Jesus & bring him down from the Minar. With
the help of righteous believers, he will rule this world for 40 years. He will
marry & have children also. Then he will die a natural death. These are
given in the Book of Tradition ( Hadith). Sayings, deeds, predictions, miracles
of our Prophet is written in the Book of Tradition ( Hadith). You said Jesus
will reign & judge. How he will judge & what is the criteria of
judgment? Please refer to Mathew 7:21-27. Calling him by Lord, spelling out the
spirit or doing miracles on his name is not sufficient to enter heaven. You
have to follow the commandments of God. Otherwise Jesus will tell you at that
time.." I don't know you, wicked people, go away." ( Mathew 7:23) .
March 6
at 11:28am · Like
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@Rahman.
your opinion is completely wrong to what Jesus said about
himself. He is coming and the whole world will see him in the sky. They will
mourn because they have rejected him. He will reign for 1000 years. He will not
marry nor have children. He will reign as God among men. He is not going to die
any natural death. Neither will any of his followers die any more. Any
Christian who lives to see the 1000 years will have power over death and shall
no more die any more
March 6
at 4:17pm · Like
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Are you sure Jesus said all these, can
you please quote where Jesus said one day man will not die in this world. If we
talk unreasonable & unrealistic in the name of religion, people will go
away from religion. They will become Atheist & Secular. It is already
happening in the West. Now please tell me What is your beliefs about Doom's day
when all will be dead?
March 6
at 8:57pm · Like
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Jesus said in John 11:25-26 "Jesus said unto her, I am the resurrection,and the life: he that believes in me, though he were dead, yet shall he
live. And whoever lives and believes in me shall never die. Believe you this?
"
"
March 6
at 10:18pm · Like
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This life Jesus talking about is the life
after resurrection. All living things will die on Doom's Day including mankind.
They will be resurrected for judgment. Thereafter, the righteous people will
have eternal life in heaven & wicked
will go to Hell fire. No body will
have eternal life in this earth. Your interpretation is wrong. Please study it
again with open mind. Our wrong interpretation may lead learned people to a
hatred for Christianity.
March 7
at 9:59am · Like
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Not everybody will die, some will not taste death but
shall be transformed which we call rapture. Those who are alive then shall be
changed and will receive ecclesiastical body. The day of final judgment comes
after the 1000 yrs of kingdom of Christ. Jesus himself is the eternal life. If
you believe in him you have eternal life because if you are alive at his
coming, you will never taste death again
March 7
at 8:29pm · Like
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We know from Quran & Traditions of our
Prophet that every thing including all Universes will be destroyed in Doom's
day. All living animals including all Angels will die. Only God Almighty will
remain alive. Then He will create new Universes with another big bang. With His
another command, all dead animals will be alive & people will assemble on
the surface of this new world to face judgment. Finally they will go to Heaven
or Hell. No more death for any people whether he is in heaven or hell. Please
comment.
March 8
at 10:21am · Like
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Your knowledge from the Quran is different from the revelation
we have in the Torah, Prophets, Psalm and the Gospel. First there will be
resurrection of the dead. Both the living and the dead shall be judged.
Thereafter God will create a new universe, wherein only the followers of Jesus
Christ will dwell and Christ with them. There shall be no more sorrow or pain
or death, for God shall wipe away their tears. The new universe will have no
need of sun or light for God shall be it's light
March 8
at 1:23pm · Like
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And what will be the fate of the people who
did not believe Jesus. They will be punished or they will be wiped out from the
universe of God. I am learning from you. Please reply for my knowledge..
March 8
at 1:58pm · Like
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Those who did not believe will have their names not written in
the book of life. The fate of those whose names are not written in the book of
life is clear. They shall be cast into the lake of fire where they shall be
tormented day and night for everlasting
March 8
at 2:21pm · Like
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That means the sinners will also have eternal
life. But they will be tormented in hell. Now please tell me something about
your system of prayer. I think we have many similarities. Jesus fasted for 40
days & night ( Mathew 4:1-2). We also have compulsory fasting for 30 days every
year. Jesus fell down on his face ( prostrate) & prayed to God (Mathew
26:39-45, Mark 14:35). We also prostrate & pray to God 5 times every day.
Jesus told to obey the commandments of God for eternal life in heaven ( Mathew
18:16-21). We follow it very strictly. We do not eat pork, no alcohol, no
adultery, using scarf in head etcetc& many other things. Now please tell me
what you do.
March 8
at 10:15pm · Like
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The sinners will live eternally. We do not call it life but
death. All those things like religious ceremonies and obeying law are good. But
they in themselves cannot provide salvation. Salvation is in Jesus. Those ceremony
were given to the Jew as shadow of things to come. In Jesus one is made
justified before God and is enabled to do the things of God.
March 8
at 11:47pm · Like
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It means that you do not prostrate to God, you
do not fast or you do not follow the Laws & Commandments of God which Jesus
Himself did. For salvation, Jesus said" to get eternal life obey the
Commandment of God ( Mathew 18:16-21). He said " For salvation give
attention to the books of Moses & Prophets (Luke 16:29). Now tell me,
should I follow what Jesus said and did or should I follow your prescription or
Paul's prescriptions. Please clarify. And when you give some information please
quote the relevant part of Bible as I do always.
March 9
at 8:42am · Like
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There is nothing wrong in prostrating to God in prayer. Jesus
prayed using many position. We also pray using many position. You can pray
while on sitting, standing, knelling etc. We fasted even better than yours i.e
40 days and night without food and only a glass of water daily. We followed the
commandment and Law of God - not the ceremonial of the OT but the moral law of
the NT. All these are fruits accompany salvation. They are not salvation in
themselves. Salvation is only acquired from what Christ did on the cross. Jesus
said so to the man in Luke: 18.18-21. It was before the cross and according to
mosaic law. But he said the man was not yet perfect. To be perfect he need to
follow Jesus. The man was sad at hearing this. Jesus said some will find it
hard to enter the kingdom of God. Jesus told the people many times that they
should eat his flesh and blood otherwise they cannot have life in them. What
Paul said was specifically to non Jews who had no tradition with the mosaic
laws whereas Jesus was speaking to the Jew at the time who were used to mosaic
law before Jesus came.
March 9
at 3:06pm · Like
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Yes, Luke 18:18-30 gives the gist of all
teachings of Jesus. He said no body is perfect except God, even Jesus himself
is not perfect.. He said-" do not do adultery, do not kill a man, do not
steal, do not lie while giving evidence, take care of your parents". He
said- you sell your every thing& give to the poor & follow me". He
said- it will be very hard for rich people to enter heaven". It is because
rich people can not sacrifice their wealth. These teachings are so eternal, it
will never lose its beauty & usefulness.We also follow them very earnestly.
But the so called followers of Jesus do not care for them, specially adultery
& caring of parents. Living together without marriage is very common &
lawful. I think Church also support it. Even Sodomy is being legalized in many
places. Nothing to talk about old parents, their place is in Old Age Home. So
sad & pathetic. We Muslim can not imagine it. Quran says-" if you do
not take care of your old parents, no chance of entering the Heaven".
Please tell me what you are doing about all these to become the real follower
of Jesus.
Saturday
at 8:05am · Like
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Jesus is perfect. The whole scripture confirmed it even your
Quran said he is faultless. I am not here to preach any religion to you. If you
want to be saved, believe in the Lord Jesus and you shall be saved. For there
is no other name, both in heaven and on earth whereby a man may be saved except
in the name of Jesus
Saturday
at 8:17am · Like
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Quran says that all Messengers of God is
perfect because they are guided by God. I know you are getting annoyed. But
tell me honestly, did I speak any thing from outside Bible? I always quote from
Bible & seek your explanation, because you are supposed to be the master of
Bible. I only point out those which are deviation from Jesus. If you can not
explain or do not want to explain, that is your personal matter.
Saturday
at 9:24am · Like
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You are neither quoting from the bible nor even considering the
wording of Quran. Sir I do not have time for unprofitable discourse. I am not
here for argument. Our message is clear Jesus came to the world to die for
sinners that those who are ordained to eternal life may believe and be saved.
Saturday
at 11:16am · Like
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Dear Sir, I do not know how to reply
you. But my Quran demands..."Bring your proof from your Book". We
know very clearly what Jesus said & what He did. It is in Bible & in
Quran. So, when we see some body or some organization trying to misguide the
world in the name of Jesus, we must ask him question. It is our moral duty.
Saturday
at 2:07pm · Like
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If you are ready to know the truth, I am with you. I have no
time for unprofitable argument. Most Muslims are not ready for the truth. They
are only interested in disseminating the self contradictory statement of their
preachers. Their debates are mostly illogical and alien to the common sense.
You have to read what Jesus said and did in the complete concept. Cutting words
is unprofitable. Jesus is elmashi - the statement is cutting across the edge.
All scriptures agreed on this - If you know what elmshi means and what his
mission is all about - you will understand the bible and the Quran. The fallacy
of Quran is admitting the fact that Isa is elmsahi and at the same time
disqualifying him from the same position - To understand Christ as a savior -
read what the OT said about him and what the NT said about him
Saturday
at 5:09pm · Like
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OT is the Old Testament of the Bible& NT is the New
Testament of the Bible
Saturday
at 6:55pm · Like
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So, whatever I quoted till now is from
NT which you follow. The word Al-masih is a Hebrew & Arabic word. I know
its meaning. First you tell me how Christian people explain this word.
Saturday
at 9:12pm · Like
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You can tell me what you understand by the word elmashi.
Sunday at
4:03am · Like
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I will not give my explanation about Al-Masih.
I am quoting from Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia.
“Masih is the Arabic word for Messiah. In modern Arabic it is used as one of the many titles of Isa (عيسى `Īsā), who is known to Christians as Jesus. Masih is used by Arab Christians as well as Muslims, and is written as Yasu' al-Masih (يسوع المسيح ) or Isa al-Masih.
The word Masih literally means "The anointed one" and in Islam, Isa al-Masih is believed to have been anointed from birth by Alläh with the specific task of being a prophet and a king. The Israelites, to whom Isa was sent, had a traditional practice of anointing their kings with oil. An Imam Bukhari Hadith describes Jesus as having wet hair that looked as if water was dripping from it, possibly meaning he was naturally anointed. Muslims believe that this is just one of the many signs that proves that Jesus is the Messiah.
In Islam, Isa is believed to hold the task of killing the false messiah (al-Dajjal, a figure similar to the Antichrist in Christianity), who will emerge shortly before him during Qiyamah (Armageddon in Islamic belief). After he has destroyed al-Dajjal, his final task will be to become leader of the Muslims. Isa will unify the Muslim Ummah (the followers of Islam) under the common purpose of worshipping Allah alone in pure Islam, thereby ending divisions and deviations by adherents. Mainstream Muslims believe that at that time Isa will dispel Christian and Jewish claims about him”.
“Masih is the Arabic word for Messiah. In modern Arabic it is used as one of the many titles of Isa (عيسى `Īsā), who is known to Christians as Jesus. Masih is used by Arab Christians as well as Muslims, and is written as Yasu' al-Masih (يسوع المسيح ) or Isa al-Masih.
The word Masih literally means "The anointed one" and in Islam, Isa al-Masih is believed to have been anointed from birth by Alläh with the specific task of being a prophet and a king. The Israelites, to whom Isa was sent, had a traditional practice of anointing their kings with oil. An Imam Bukhari Hadith describes Jesus as having wet hair that looked as if water was dripping from it, possibly meaning he was naturally anointed. Muslims believe that this is just one of the many signs that proves that Jesus is the Messiah.
In Islam, Isa is believed to hold the task of killing the false messiah (al-Dajjal, a figure similar to the Antichrist in Christianity), who will emerge shortly before him during Qiyamah (Armageddon in Islamic belief). After he has destroyed al-Dajjal, his final task will be to become leader of the Muslims. Isa will unify the Muslim Ummah (the followers of Islam) under the common purpose of worshipping Allah alone in pure Islam, thereby ending divisions and deviations by adherents. Mainstream Muslims believe that at that time Isa will dispel Christian and Jewish claims about him”.
Sunday
at 7:22pm · Like This is …………………………………….finished…………
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it is so interesting the kind of stories Quran put forward. They
seems similar to some biblical stories and yet they contradict the biblical
facts. According to the bible Jesus is not going to literary kill the anti
Christ. Just before Jesus return back to earth, an angel will pick the anti
Christ and the false prophet and throw them into hell. Jesus is coming back
only for his church and He spoke only of his church in the book of revelation
(meaning call out believer) which is the bride of the lamb (Jesus). As he is
coming from heaven, according to the revelation, he has a name written on his
forehead as king of kings and lord of lords. The revelation said Jesus will be
God dwelling among the children of men. His name is also Emanuel meaning God
with us. In the revelation only those who washes their garment in the blood of the
lamb shall have access to the holy city. If you want to know more about Jesus
and what he said about himself , read the book of revelation. This was given
after Jesus had been glorified - and had returned back to heaven
Sunday
at 9:28pm · Like
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The function of messiah is actually to save. This is what he did
when he first came. Though some prophets had worked miracles before him, but
none did it so frequently as he did. Most prophets only worked miracle at
random but Jesus healed everybody who came in contact with him - yet the
Jew did not believe on him. Thereafter he gave his disciples the holy ghost
which the Quran called "Ahmad" to continue the work of the miracle.
Note we are still doing it till today because the "Ahmad" is still
with us working the miracle through us. He said we shall do it in his name and
we are still doing it in the name of Jesus since 2000 years ago. It has not
stopped working.
Sunday
at 9:36pm · Like
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Ahmed is another name of our Prophet Muhammad
given by Allah. Roots of both the name is same. It is Hamd which means
Praising. I have lot of question about revelation. I will talk about it later
on.
Sunday
at 11:26pm · Like
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Only doing miracles in the name of Jesus will
not save a person. See Mathew 7:21-23. Jesus said.."Those who call me
Lord, oh Lord, can not enter the paradise except those who obeys the
commandments of Father. They will tell me, Lord, did not we spell out spirit on
thy name, did not we do miracles on thy name? I will say, I do not know you,
wicked people, go away from me." You just tell me, do you believe this
instruction of Jesus?
Yesterday
at 8:18am · Like
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I am not telling you that doing miracle in the name of Jesus
will save a man. We do teach holiness and purity of life. Our ministry is one
of the very few that emphasize practical Christian living. What am saying is
that Jesus Christ is the only one ordained by God to save. He is the only
way to God. No salvation in any other names apart from the name of Jesus. If
Mohamed (PBUH) did not accept Christ into his life before he died, no salvation
for him
Yesterday
at 2:07pm · Like
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Our Prophet used to call Jesus & Moses
as-"My brother Jesus & my brother Moses". Quran says-"Do not
differentiate between the Prophets". We believe in all prophets. But they
have different type of miracles for specific purposes. Like, Moses used to
talk to God directly to receive His guidance. There was no Angels in between.
Other prophets, including Jesus, used to get Directives through Angels. Our
Prophet used to be contacted by Angel Gabriel. Only once, He was taken up
through the universes (7 skies) to meet & talk to God directly. We call it
Meeraj. During this visit, He met Jesus in 4th sky. He met other Prophets also
in different skies. Next time I want to give my views on the book of revelation
of Bible, if you agree.
Yesterday
at 3:11pm · Like
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Jesus did not get any directive from the angel. He knows as God
knows and sees as God sees. Even David in his prophecy called him my lord.
There is no record in the bible where God spoke to Jesus as he spoke to Moses
or to Elijah. Jesus had a special intimate relationship with God. Only
were there few occasion where an audible Voice came from heaven not directly to
Jesus but as a confirmation to every one around. Jesus may call us his brother
but we do not have any right to call him our brother. He is our Lord. I can
understand that Mohammed (PBUH) could have told many stories to convince his
followers that he is indeed a prophet sent by God. His stories did not have any
confirmation apart from what he said himself. The bible stories has
confirmation throughout ages by the different prophets and Apostles
Yesterday
at 3:48pm · Like
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All scriptures of the world has the prophecy
of coming of the last Prophet & insisted to follow Him. Other prophets are
for some particular race/tribe. But the last Prophet is for the whole mankind.
This prophecy is in Torah, in Old Testament, in New Testament. It is in
Hindu scripture also. God said to Moses-" I will raise a Prophet like you
from your Brethren & I will put my words to his mouth. He does what I say
Him ( Deuteronomy 18:18). Jesus told- " I will ask my Father to send the
Comforter....He will teach you every thing...He will give witness for me...
John 14:15-17, 14:24-26, 15:26-27, 16:7-15). Comforter does not mean Holy
Spirit. Latin word is Periclitos. It means who praises, means Ahmed in
Arabic/Hebrew. Another name of our last Prophet is Ahmed. In fact Jews were
waiting for 3 persons- Ylyas, Masih& the last Prophet. "People asked
John- Are you Ylyas, Masih or that Prophet ( John 1:20-21)". Now John is
Ylyas, Jesus is Masih. But who is that Prophet? He is our Prophet Mohammad (
PBUH). During the life time of our Prophet, all the learned man from Christian
& Jews recognized Him as the last prophet & many of them accepted
Islam. Some of them did not accept in the fear of losing their power &
material benefits. Even today, thousands of Christian friends are accepting
Islam every year. So my friend, please open your heart & seek the truth.
13 hours
ago · Like
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There is no single verse in the Scripture either in the Old
Testament, the Psalm or New Testament that ever for one single word made
referenced to any Last Prophet. You Moslem twisted everything you read in the
scripture to your taste. To Moses "I will raise a Prophet like you
from your Brethren & I will put my words to his mouth. He does what I say
Him ( Deuteronomy 18:18). " How could this ever be Mohammed. Mohammed was
not a Jew. Jesus said "I will ask my Father to send the Comforter....He
will teach you every thing...He will give witness for me... John 14:15-17,
14:24-26, 15:26-27, 16:7-15).". How could ever this be Mohammed.Another
comforter who will give witness for Jesus and spoke not for himself. Mohammed
did not speak for Jesus rather for himself. He did not preach Christ. This is
how John14.15-17 reads "And I will pray the Father, and he shall give you
another Comforter, that he may abide with you forever; 17 Even the Spirit of
truth; whom the world cannot receive, because it seethe him not, neither
knoweth him: but ye know him; for hedwelleth with you, and shall be in you.
" Is this Mohammed? does he abide with us forever. Was Mohammed the spirit
of the truth that dwells in us and is in us?. Mohammed is dead. Jesus was using
the word comforter here to state the function of the Holy Spirit. He told them
in vs 18"I will not leave you comfortless: I will come to you." If at
all only Jesus and John could be the prophet. Both were referred to in every
capacity as the long awaited prophet. Prophet is the office they occupied.
Elias or Messiah is the roles of the office. Only stupid man will ever accept
Islam based on the statement that Mohammed could be the last Prophet. There is
nothing like the last prophet. God is still raising Prophets even nowadays.
Gift of prophecy is today more rampant as before because God gives Holy Ghost
now to everybody who asks him for it
5 hours
ago · Like
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I think your definition of Prophet is
different from us. Prophet, Messengers of God, Nabi, Rasul, Spirit of Truth etc
are synonymous. God sends them to guide mankind to His path. In that sense Nuh,
Abraham, Moses, David, Jesus, Mohammad, all are Prophets. Now, the promised
Prophets will be raised not from the Jews, but from the Brethren of Jews. Arabs
are the Brethren of Jews because they are from Ismail who was brother of Isaac.
Jews are the sons of Isaac. The Promised Prophet is to come from Sons of
Ismail. I think you will not like this interpretation. Your Bible has been
edited, modified, revised so many times to suit the will/requirement of your
Popes that it is very difficult to find out truth from it. Every version is
different from another version. Some Bible are having 66 books, some are having
more than 70 books. Now tell me which one is to follow, Bible with 66 books or
Bible with 73 books?. You are commenting on Islam without reading Quran &
Hadith. But whatever I talk about Christianity, it is with the full
understanding of Bible& I am always quoting from Bible..
3 hours
ago · Like
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Spirit of the truth is never synonymous with messenger. A
messenger is a carrier of the message. A Prophet is one who exercised the gift
of prophecy. Spirit of the truth is a spirit of God, that inspired a prophet. A
prophet may be influenced by the Spirit but this does not make him the spirit.
A messenger is not his message. Arab descended from Ishmael and not from Isaac.
They are not the brethren of Jacob. But the word referred to the brethren to
whom the prophet would focused not to their ancestry. The whole of prophecy in
the torah repeated the same things about the coming of the holy one. Ishmael
according to the Old Testament should not inherit the promise of Abraham. He
was driven out of Abraham's house. The bible of 21 century is the same with any
bible ever discovered that were written in any centuries. The Torah are the books
of the Jew. No version of the bible differed to any other. It is only you
Muslim saying that versions are different. I have not discovered any bible that
is different to another in its entirety. Some scholars may not agree on some
certain minor verses yet are always in unity as to the whole. The books whose
authorship had not been identified are classified under apocryphal. My friend
no one can be kidnapped to heaven. When the gospel is preached, if you believe
you will be saved. If you believe not, you are already condemned. I know the
content of Quran. I bought a Quran for myself when I was 13years old. When
reading the Quran, it does not suggest that God was speaking to Mohammad. It
looks more like poetry and literary narration. To have an idea of how God
speaks, read the Old Testament. You are not reading the bible to understand it.
If you read the bible you will find life.
·
I
think you have read Quran at your early life or read it partially. Please read
it now & you will find what it is. In whole Quran, Allah is speaking in
First Person with imperative sentences, with commanding voices. See some
examples. The first 5 sentences which revealed to Mohammad (PBUH)
is-"1. Read, in the name of thy Lord & Cherisher, who created---, 2.
Created man, out of a leech like clot.3. Read, and your Lord is most Bountiful.
4. He who taught (use of) the Pen 5. Taught man that he knew not." . Below
is the example of a very small chapter from Quran-"1. Say; He is Allah,
the One; 2. Allah, the Eternal, Absolute; 3. He begetteth not, nor is He
begotten; 4. And there is none like unto Him". Sometimes Allah addresses
specifically; like-" Oh mankind", " Oh son of Adam", "
Oh people of Books", " Oh Believers" etc . Yes, we see similar
style of talking in many places in Old Testament when God speaking directly.
But the style in New Testament is quite different. A third person is describing
everything & sometimes giving quotation from Jesus. It is just like our
Hadith where a third person is telling about the actions, speeches, methods
& day to day life of Mohammad (PBUH)
·
Though the first chapter
of Quran does not look the one you have quoted above, still you could see that
it is more like a preaching than God's revelation. The way God speaks in Old
Testament is quite different from the one you have in Quran. The New Testament,
writings were composed as a reminder of the
preaching preached by the apostles. The Apostles repeated the preaching as they
have learnt from Jesus and as the Holy Ghost reminded them or revealed to them.
The Holy Ghost was also confirming their preaching not with sword but with sign
following.
·
I
have quoted from chapter 96 & 112. But first 5 verses of chapter 96 was
first revelation to Mohammad (PBUH). Chapters of Quran are not chronologically
arranged as it reveals. Chapters revealed at Makkah during initial stage of
Islam are put mostly at the back of Quran. Most of
the time, whole chapter was not revealed at a time. It was gradual as per the
requirement of the day. It took 23 years for whole Quran to be revealed.
Chapters revealed at Medina are mostly very long & they are put at the front
pages of Quran. I request you to read Quran now with understanding & open
mind. I hope you will get the Spirit of it.
·
Now
may I ask question about book of Revelation?. As I observed, it is full of
predictions for future by John. It is not prediction by Jesus. I failed to
understand how predictions by John are included in Bible. Even now a day, many
Christian people are giving predictions. Prediction
of Nostradamus & Jean Dickson are coming true even today. Are you going to
include them in Bible? However, I want to discuss & know about it because
the whole Christian World is reacting & planning on these predictions. My
first question, who is Lamb mentioned in many places in Revelation? Where is
Mount Zion? Who are the people you call Anti-Christ? Do you think Jews are also
Anti-Christ? The Beast & Dragon mention in this book is also Anti-Christ?
·
The
Anti Christ regime is the tribulation of Jacob. The Jew will suffer the most.
2/3 shall perish. 1/2 will survive. When Jesus appears the surviving 1/3 shall
behold Jesus as the Lord and shall believe in him. The whole set of the
revelation is set for the future. Some signs are already in place like the
Global satellite broadcasting, Unification of identity and the building of the
Jewish temple etc
·
Still
you are not honest & brave enough to declare Jews as Anti-Christ. Is it
because they are now friends of Christian people? It may be true that the
remaining 1/3 Jews will realize & accept Jesus after the defeat of Beast
and Devil by Jesus. But it is so obvious that Jews are always Anti-Christ from
the very beginning & they will remain so till the 2nd coming of Jesus. Now,
if we analyze the contents of Revelation, we see that there will be 4 distinct
periods coming one after another. When the 1st seal is ripped off by Lamb, a
man on a white horse with a bow was given a victory garland. He rode off
victorious, conquering right & left
.
KhalilurRahman My
last quotation was from Rev 6:1-2. With the breaking of 2nd seal, a man with a
red horse came out. He was given power to destroy the peace of the world. This
condition will continue till the 7th seal is broken. Now please refer Rev
12:1-17. The Dragon with 7 heads & 10 horns was thrown to this earth. And a
son was born in desert area who will rule this world with iron hand. Dragon was
trying to eat up this son. But he was kept in a safe place to God & his mother
was hiding in desert. Now this Dragon started fighting with the people who
follow the Commandments of God & give witness about Jesus. And the Dragon
was waiting in the sea shore.
·
KhalilurRahman Rev
13 gives the description of the Beast with 7 heads & 10 horns who is coming
out of sea with great fire power like those of modern age. It will create havoc
in Middle East area & will have influence over all the nations, states,
language & tribes. People who will follow them will lose their eternal life
in heaven. Rev 14 tells that the Lamb is waiting on Mount Zion with 144,000
dedicated young followers who never committed any sins like adultery, telling
lie etc. Rev 17:9-14 tells us what is the meaning of 7 heads & 10 horns of
that Beast. 7 heads means 7 mountains they sit on & 7 kings also. 10 horns
are another 10 kings. All nations of the world give their power to this Beast
This Beast along with that Dragon creates havoc in the world. The Beast is
Anti-Christ & naturally the Dragon also Anti-Christ. They will fight with
the Lamb, but loose. Now, Rev 19:11-21 tells about another man with a white
horse named Faithful & Truth. Nobody knows His actual name except he
himself. He will fight & capture that Beast along with his followers &
killed them all. The birds are having feast with their flesh.
·
KhalilurRahman This
is the prediction given in the book of Revelation. Now we can analyze what all
these means. The First man with a white horse & with a bow, conquering left
& right is nobody but Mohammad (PBUH) & his Islam. After Jesus, Islam
is the only Power which spread left & right all over the world. Note the
weapon they are using, it is only Bow & swords. After the Golden days of
Islam, peace is withdrawn & problem started in the world. War between the
nations, colonialism, World Wars itself killed millions of people all over the
world. Then comes the Beast & Dragon. Both of them are coming out from the
sea with tremendous fire power, with fire &sulpher, bombing from air &
land, destroying hundreds of miles in front of them with one burst. This is
nothing but the Modern days weapon. Both the Beast & Dragon are taking power from each other. They fight
& wait in the sea. All the kings of the world give their power to this
beast. It has 7 heads & 10 horns means supported by another 17 kings. Rev
17:9 says," You use your head to understand whatever will be told
now". I also say, if you think very clearly & use your intelligence,
you can clearly see who this Beast is & who is Dragon. Jesus will come
& defeat them. But they will be captured & destroyed by that man of
Faithful & Truth. In our Hadith it is mentioned that he is Imam Mahdi.
Mahdi means Faithful & Truth. We also do not know his actual name.
·
·
The Anti Christ is a man,
a despot and the son of perdition. This man will make himself sit in the Jewish
temple and made himself to be worshipped as God. He will remove the Jewish
daily sacrifice. The Anti Christ will make covenant with the Jewish nation for 7 years to help them solve the
middle east problem and in the middle will break off his promise. Whether the
Jewish are ant Christ? Some of them believe and some believe not.
·
My friend. Your
interpretation is totally wrong. The man on the white horse conquering right
and left cannot be Mohammed. This man is either the Anti Christ or one who
should immediately precede him. See matt 24. That was the beginning of woes and
sorrow that should preceded the coming of Christ. The weapon they used is only
imagery depicting the weapons known to the people. To know who the dragon is
read Rev.20. The man sitting on the horse whose name is faithful is Jesus. He
is called the Word of God. Rev.19.13 and the King of Kings vs.16
·
Many
Christian people wrote themselves that the present Bible is fabricated,
revised, deleted, added & interpolated so many times. But whatever is
available now, that also you people are interpreting not correctly. As a result
people are misguided all over the places. You said
Lamb is Jesus. Lamb (Jesus) mow waiting on the mount of Zion with his followers
( Rev 14). After this Rev 19:11 describe about another man, sitting on a white
horse, nobody knows his name & his title is Faithful & Truth. No where
it is mentioned that he is Jesus. How you can make him Jesus? You may interpret
it as you like. But people using their heads will not accept it. Anti-Christ,
Beast, Dragon, they are not a single man. They are group of people, headed by a
leader & capable of fighting a big war.
·
·
·
The
present bible is not fabricated, revised, deleted, added and interpolated. What
is revised in the Revised Standard Version is only the English Grammatik to
make it more understandable than the old English of KJV. But KJV has also
modernized its own English as well
·
If
you read your bible with understanding on the whole event surrounding each of
the stage. You will be able to see the connection in everything.
·
My friend I have quoted
above that the man on the white horse is the word of God. Jesus is the word of
God. Besides he is a judge and only Jesus is ascribed this position in the
bible. Beside the verse did not tell you that no one knew his name. This
is what is written in Rev. 19.12"His eyes were as a flame of fire, and on
his head were many crowns; and he had a name written, that no man knew, but he
himself. Off 1:14;". He had a name written on the crown which no man knew
·
The
Anti Christ is the same as the beast. An Image of the beast was made which
again turned into a living creature. The Dragon is the devil. Both work
together: The dragon, the beast and the prophet. Look my friend I do not have
time for a useless debate
·
See the description of
Jesus in Rev.1.14"His head and his hairs were white like wool, as white as
snow; and his eyes were as a flame of fire; Dan 7:9; Off 19:12; 15 And his feet
like unto fine brass, as if they burned in a furnace; and his voice as
the sound of many waters. Off 14:2; 16 And he had in his right hand seven
stars: and out of his mouth went a sharp two-edged sword: and his countenance
was as the sun shined in his strength. Jes 49:2; Eph 6:17; Heb 4:12; Off 2:16;
Off 19:15; 17 And when I saw him, I fell at his feet as dead. And he laid his
right hand upon me, saying unto me, Fear not; I am the first and the last: Jes
41:4; Jes 44:6; Jes 48:12; 18 I am he that liveth, and was dead; and, behold, I
am alive for evermore, Amen; and have the keys of hell and of death. "
·
Jesus
is called the son of God. He is called son of man also? Problem is, whatever I am asking you, you are
claiming it is Jesus. Who is son of God-reply is Jesus. Who is son of man-
Jesus. Who is man on white horse- Jesus. Who is on red horse-Jesus. Who is
Spirit of God-Jesus. Who is holy spirit- Jesus. Who is spirit of truth-Jesus..
Who is the Helper coming later on-Jesus. You claim everything to be Jesus. But
it is not true. Each one is having separate time slot to happen & they are
different people.
·
He
called himself so. He called himself the son of man during his time here on
earth as he preached. Jesus is both God and Man. Emmanuel meaning God with us.
·
I
find at least one learned man who inform me that Jesus used to call himself son
of man in this earth. I want to ask you one last question. My Christian friends
claim that Revelation gives prediction of all important incidents which will happen till last day. Now, rising of Islam, spreading it
east & west from Morocco to Indonesia, spreading day by day, it must be an
important incident. I want to know is there any prediction about Islam in
Revelation? If yes, where it is?
No, there is no prediction of Islam in the Bible.
Prediction in the bible were either local - event surrounding the prophet or
global. The Global event has much to do with certain plan of God or are in between
stages within a certain divineplan. The main focus of the Bible prophecy is
about Christ. The Global event within his first coming were predicted in as
much as they were related to the Jew. And the global event closed to his second
coming are also predicted because they will also be related to the Jew. Islam
does not fall to any of these categories. Islam is just another type of
religion that spread within his region through establishment of empires and
jihadist. The significant spread of Islam has nothing to do with Mohammed or
his immediate successors. Islam spread magnificently in the 16 - 17 centuries
through the ottoman empire (Suleiman the Magnificent).Saturday at 12:18pm
· LikeUnlike
All of us understand that The Bible & its
prediction deal with the area in Middle East. This whole area is now occupied
& inhabited by the Muslims for last 1500 years. It is likely to remain so
till last, although may be occupied time to time by foreign forces. This area
will be the arena of activities by Jesus, Anti-Christ, the Beast & the Dragon. So, Prediction is
not complete without the prediction of Islam. Either it is dropped from Bible
or Christian Scholars are misinterpreting it. I think, the first man riding on
a white horse with a bow on his back, conquering east & west, is nobody but
Islam It is not correct that Islam only spread during the time of Suleiman, the
Magnificent. He spread out towards Europe. But, by 13th century,
Islam already spread from Spain/Morocco in West to Indonesia in East. Please
note that almost whole of Middle East including Jerusalem came under Islam
during 2nd Caliph of Islam.
Hey Islam is not substantive. No
religion was ever prophesized in the Bible. Religion is and cannot be a focus
of prophecy. Your thought about the first man being an Islam is ridiculous.
Even if the first man on the horse should be Islam, this does not make it on
divine plan. Besides the time of the fulfillment of the entire end time
prophecy lies within a generation (70 years) and precisely within a 7 years
plan. finished…….10/08/12
Your concept of time does not
commensurate with time of Allah. Bible said, the universe is created by 6 days.
You think 6 days means 6x24 hours in worldly calculation. This is the mistake
you are committing. Quran says- My one
day is equal to your 50,000 years. It also says- The universe is created in 6
periods. This is the correct explanation
of time & space. If you try to propagate your concept of time, people
specially the scientist will not accept it. Few days back , you have given the
description how Jesus look like when he comes back. “His
head and his hairs were white like wool, as white as snow; and his eyes were as
a flame of fire; And his feet like unto fine brass, as if they burned in a
furnace; and his voice as the sound of many waters. And he had in his right
hand seven stars: and out of his mouth went a sharp two-edged sword’: If you
take this description for Jesus himself, he, then, does not look like a man; he
looks very funny. My dear friend, this description is for his power, his
weapons, and his carrier. In this place, it may be the powerful fighter
aircraft he will be using during the war against the beast & devil. The
prediction given by Nostradamus is much more practical, logical & realistic
than your explanation. Many of them has already come true & the remaining
are likely to come true. I feel, the prediction of Nostradamus supports the
prediction of Bible. In our Hadith, many
descriptions are given about the arrival of Jesus & Mahdi ( Faithful&
Truth). If you consult all these, you may get the correct interpretation of all
these predictions.
The Evangelistic Ministry of AladesanmiAdeyemi :
I
have no time for any unprofitable debate. The six days as projected in the
Bible is the human six days (i.e 6x24hrs). God himself created this day during
the creation of the world. In eternity there is no day and night. So 1000 yrs
here on earth will seem like a day there, because all the time is a day there.
Your Nostradamus has no prediction that I know to be accurate. Even if he had
predicted things, devil can also make some inaccurate predictions and star
readers can also make un-precise prediction. It has nothing to do with biblical
prophecy. The resemblance you read has nothing to do with his power. This is
how he appeared to John. And if he wants could appear in a different way. If
God should appear to you, how do you think he would look like? Forget not that
the Jesus you knew as a man is no more, now he is Jesus the divine. His body
has been transformed after his resurrection and the more after taking his sit
at the right hand of God. Jesus is not going to use any physical force to
destroy the enemy. God does not need any physical or technological invention to
destroy the enemy. The sword coming out of his mouth will deal with them. The
sword is his word. Your Quran is found of repeating the biblical statement with
lack of understanding. God created the world with word and not by evolution.
There is no need of any six periods."
I am sorry to kill your time for
unprofitable debate. But I am getting benefited with knowledge. I not only
discuss with you, I discuss & read the books of other religion also like
Hindu, Buddha, Jews, and Atheist etc. I am a student of comparative religion.
Quran says-“Every tribe/race/nation received messengers from Allah”. So all the
religions are coming from the same origin & the basis has to be same. Problem is, they had been getting
corrupted with the passage of time.
Science is also created by God & the
whole universe is very strictly following that science. It says-“without
religion science is lame, but without science religion is blind”. Any
established fact of science is true & religion must agree that it is true.
If any religion does not agree to an established fact of science, there must be
some error of concept/interpretation in that religion. Due to this reason, many
ChristianStates broke away from the Church & became secular during 17th/18th/19th
century. Communism & Atheism are also developed as a revolt against
Christianity. So you must come out of your compartmental ideas & seek truth
with open heart.
The Evangelistic Ministry of AladesanmiAdeyemi :
"My friend if you are a student you should be
ready to learn and not be wasting my time. If you apply reason to your
knowledge, you will understand that every religion of the world developed out
of rebellion against the true God. All religions in this world are not seeking
after the true God. They make God for themselves and build for themselves hope
in ignorance. The only true religion is the religion of God Yahweh who has
revealed himself to the forefathers of the Jew, to Abraham, to Isaac and to
Jacob. He called Moses to deliver the children of Israel out of slavery and to
bring them to the Promised Land according to the promise given to Abraham. The
same God send prophets to the children of Israel who made prophecy of the
coming messiah. The messiah in the person of Jesus came and established all
things and revealed to us the fundament of God. Science is only discovering
what is. Religion is a question of faith whereas Science a question of logic.
Religion is neither against logic nor illogical sunder it is above logic. You
cannot always explain the things of God with logical calculation. The turning
of state to secularism has nothing to do with religion. It is the desire of men
to separate state and the church and made it possible to enforce human right for
all and fight against discrimination and encourage tolerance. This is the
essence of democracy. It works well with the western culture. In Islamic states
where this is not the case, one could see how development is hindered and the
police became an agent of terrorism."
So, you agree that the religion of Abraham, Isaac,
Jacob & Moses is a true religion from God. We Muslim also say the same. If
we analyze their beliefs, actions, advices & concepts, we get the gist of a
true religion from God. But we see that present Christianity is almost in
opposite pole compared to the faiths of above Messengers of God. Quran says-
“Abraham followed a very straight path & he gave us the name of Muslim
which means a total submission to Allah”. In fact we Muslim follow the path of
Abraham. In all our prayers, we send respect to Abraham.
Islam started Democracy 1500 years back. Mohammad
(PBUH) did not select his successor. First four caliphs of Islam were elected
by the people. Subsequently, it was converted to monarchy which was the fault
of Muslims, not Islam.
Nostradamus was a Christian priest like you in
France during 16th century. His predictions included two great world
wars which are already passed. The 3rd& last Great War with
Anti-Christ is also mentioned in his prediction. A film named “A man who saw
tomorrow” is also made based on his predictions. I will give you a clip about
him from Wikipedia at a later stage.
Do you think, God has sent Prophets to the Children
of Israel only? Then what about other nations of the world? What about Greek,
Romans, Persians, Indians, Chinese & many others? Population of Israel is
very negligible compared to these great nations of the world even during the
time of Jesus. Do you think God did not send any Messengers to guide these huge
people? Can God do so much injustice to His creation? These people are also
created by same God who is God of you & me. Whereas Quran says-“ I sent my
Messengers to every race/tribe/nations”
The Evangelistic Ministry of
AladesanmiAdeyemi :
"I am not here to discuss about the
present day Christianity but to present Christ as the only Savior of the world.
Abraham desired to see the day of Jesus and he rejoiced when he saw it. No
religion can save anybody. Faith in Christ is the only ticket to salvation. Abraham
did not give you a name of Muslim but Mohammed gave it to you. Muslim is
unknown to Abraham and the name "Allah" is unknown to him as well. It
is true that Abraham Isaac and Jacob and some of the children of Israel had a
good relationship with a living God. It is only in Christianity you will ever
find some groups of people with a living relationship with a true God. God only
reveals himself in the present last day through his son Jesus Christ. God sent
prophets to the Jew of old. Now he is no more sending prophets to them except
through Christianity (through faith in Christ). The last prophet to be sent
will be during the anti Christ when he shall send Moses and Elijah to them
again. Whether Nostradamus prophecy was a real prediction I do not know since I
have not actually studied his predictions. It is not uncommon to predict in
Christianity. We have many 1000 of prophets worldwide making predictions that
are coming true. God himself choose to love Israel out of all the children of
the earth. Through Jesus Christ God show his love for the whole world by
reconciling them to himself through Jesus."
You do not know the exact terminology
used by Abraham till Jesus, because you do not know Hebrew/Arabic which the
Language of them was. Jesus never said “God” & he did not know the language
of English or Latin. Even you do not have the original script of Bible in
Hebrew. Now you are translating back to Hebrew from Latin or English. When
Jesus was put to cross, he shouted-“ Elli, Elli, lama sabaktani. Lord, Lord,
why you have left me off”. This word is
having same origin of Allah or Elah. The root of Islam & Muslim comes from
Salam which means peace. The Hebrew is Shalom which Jesus himself use to utter
to greet his people.
You said Israelis are the chosen people
of God. But they are the only people who rejected Jesus very strongly, did not
believe his divine birth & tried to kill him. Now they have become cursed
people by God. Ironically, present Christian nations are very friendly with
them.
Mathew
15:24 Jesus said-“I am sent only to the lost sheep
of Israel”.
Mathew 23:2-3
-“Do what you are told to follow the laws of Moses”.
Luke
16:29 “For salvation, give
attention to the books of Moses & Prophets”.
Do you believe these are the sayings of Jesus &
he did not tell lie? If so, please follow Jesus & do not do blasphemy which
was devised by Paul & other Christian scholars after the departure of
Jesus.
The Evangelistic Ministry of
AladesanmiAdeyemi:
"either you are not interested in the
truth or you love blind argument. I have no time for unprofitable debate.
Abraham spoke Hebrew and not Arabic. Jesus Spoke Aramaic and not Arabic. In all
these, God of Hebrew revealed himself as Yahweh. The people called him Adonai
and Elohim which simply means God or Lord. Jesus spoke eloi or eli on the cross
which means God. The same prefix was also before his name in Quran elmashi
meaning God the Messiah. None called themselves Muslim meaning "submission
to Allah". They never used this terminology anywhere in their history
though they were submitted to God. Mohammed invented this terminology. Allah
was not invented by Mohammed with the mindset of true God. Allah was one of the
99 gods of Arabian. This can never be the true God. In all languages, there are
names for small gods, no one ever attempt to use these names for true God with
exception of Mohammed. This is why Allah can never be the name of true God. The
religion of God is a religion of the heart not by name. Jesus did not call his
followers Christian and they do not call themselves Christian as well. They
were called Christians by others. The Jews never gave a terminology to
their religion. Whether Jew rejected Christ or not, you cannot change the mind
of God on the Jew. He had love them with everlasting love. At the right time
they will be replanted again. The Jew’s rejection of Christ has been predicted.
It was probably in the wisdom of God to use it as a means of saving the world.
If they had accepted him, they would/ may have prevented his death and the
salvation for the mankind. A true Jew and not just a Jew by name will accept
Jesus."
Both Arabic & Aramaic comes from
Hebrew. So they have many similar words sounding almost same with similar
meanings. It is not elmashi in Quran. It is Al-Masih. Al is an article in
Arabic. Normally Quran mentioned Jesus
as Isa Masih-ibne Mariam which means Jesus masih, the son of Marry. The meaning
of Masih also I quoted previously from Wikipedia. We must understand that both
Arabs & Jews are the descendents of Abraham. They were following the same
religion of Abraham. The word Allah, Eloi or Elli came from same origin
Abraham. How do you know that Abraham did not call Allah? You do not have any
original script of Bible in Aramaic or Hebrew. The ancient script you may have
today is the Latin translation. So, you will not get the actual terminology
there. But the question is not the
language. You &me are not expert also in those languages. I quoted some
verses from your Bible which you did not touch at all. Can you please explain
those verses for my satisfaction?
Mathew
15:24 Jesus said-“I am sent
only to the lost sheep of Israel”.
Mathew 23:2-3
-“Do what you are told to follow the laws of Moses”.
Luke
16:29 “For salvation, give
attention to the books of Moses & Prophets”.
These verses clearly tell us—(a) Jesus is sent only
for the people of Israel, not for you & me. (b) Salvation lies in the books
of Moses & Prophets.
Dear Sir, it seems that you have stopped
communicating with me. But, I want to ask you my last question. This is for my
knowledge. It is about Holy Ghost. My Christian friends say, they always
discuss with Holy Ghost at night for any problem. How do you do it? Do you meet
him at meditation or in a dream, or talk to him directly face to face. And in
what shape he comes. I hope you will give me your experience with Holy Ghost
slightly in detail.
The store house of God
never runs dry. Islam says same thing. If my Christian friends forsake their
concept of Trinity, then there is no difference between us.
My friend, stop deceiving yourself. There is no
salvation in any other names except the name of Jesus. Denying the holy
trinity is to deny God. If you deny him he will
deny you.KhalilurRahmanDear Sir, Trinity is not a new phenomenon in religion. It is there in Hinduism also for last 5000 years as Brahma, Wisnu& Shiva. One is creator, one is sustainer & one is destroyer. The pagan Romans also had 3 Gods. Most probably, the Christian scholars got the idea of Trinity from Roman influences long after the departure of Jesus. Jesus never said about Trinity. Rather He said- "Hear O'israel ...the Lord our God is one Lord ". Now, I have come across another group of Christian who believes in the father, mother, son &holy spirit. They have included Virgin Mary & now it becomes 4 in 1. How you can explain all these. So, atleast , let us come to one point which is common to us. That is we worship One God & we do not associate any partner to Him.
There is no religion
that teaches trinity. Only Christianity taught us that there is one God made
manifest in three persons. Trinity is not about multiple Gods. Trinity is three
united. No religion ever taught you about a God consisting of three distinctive
personalities.
In Christianity the
three united do not argue, nor contradict each other. There is perfect harmony
and perfect unity. You do not find such unity even in family, talkless of in
powers.
what you believe or what you
think or anybody believes is not the object of the Gospel. The Gospel is as it
is preached by the Lord Jesus and by those who heard him.
The
Evangelistic Ministry of AladesanmiAdeyemi : There is only one God made of the father and the word and the
spirit. How ignorant a man must be to think the holy spirit is not part of
Godhead or that the word is not part of Godhead. KhalilurRahman
:You said there is a great
harmony among the gods of trinity & there are no contradictions between
them. It is because Jesus & Holy Spirit are under the direct command of God
Almighty. They cannot do anything without the permission of God. So, question
of contradiction does not arise at all. Jesus said-“I do not do anything from
myself. My father orders me what to say. His order is eternal life.” (John
5:19, 5:30, 5:36, 6:38, 7:16-17, 8:28, 12:49-50). The terminology like The
Word, Holy Spirit is used in Quran also. But you interpret them in such a way
that they become part of God. In Arabic, word is Kalimah& spirit is Ruh. In
fact every man has Ruh from God Almighty. RuhulQudus means the High Spirit
which is the name of Arc Gabriel. You call him Holy Spirit. Holy Spirit is
there even before the coming of Jesus. He appeared to Mary to inform her about
the birth of Jesus. Another point, Bible does not describe what happened when
Mary appeared to her people with her new born son. We know that Jews did not
believe the miraculous birth of Jesus. Then why they did not punish Mary for
adultery? Do you have any answer to this question ? I am sure, no Christian can
reply this. But Quran gives the reply. Read chapter 19 ( Surah Mariam) from
Quran & you will get all answers about Jesus. Mary came to her people with
her new born son when they challenged her. Mary signaled them to talk to the
baby. They said-" How we can talk to an infant of cradle". But Jesus
started talking to them-" I am servant of God. He has given me Book &
made me His Messenger..........". Jews were highly astonished by this
miracle. They did not dare to punish Mary & let her go away. This is not
only a miracle of Jesus, but he testified the chastity of his mother by this
miracle. Christians does not know about this first miracle. As such, they are
always trying to make Jesus the begotten Son of God to justify his miraculous
birth. God save us.The
Evangelistic Ministry of AladesanmiAdeyemi : They could do
every thing on their own but choose not to do anything without the other part.
The word and the Holy Spirit are part of God himself and part of his existence.
God did not do anything but through the son. The son could not do anything but what he sees the father doing. I am surprised
at your intelligence. How could you deny that the spirit is part of God or that
the word is not part of him? Your sense taught you that the spirit of a man and
his body are part of him. Jesus has been even before Adam. I have not time to
debate a stupid question. Why should they punish Mary when the husband did not
reject here?. What your Quran wrote is stupid and nonsense. Jesus was born with
Joseph and Mary present. KhalilurRahmanCan you please give me the reference in Bible where
it is said God did not do anything but through the son & Jesus has been
even before Adam. Can you please clarify your last sentence? Do you mean that
Mary was married to Joseph when Jesus was born? Then how you can say that Jesus
was born without father. What we say about spirit is that all spirit ( Ruh) are
the Command ( Amr in Arabic) of God. They are certainly not a part of God. Even
your Holy Ghost is not a part of God. Word is also not a part of God. When you
speak, you create the word. But it is not a part of you. Why don't you apply
normal logic & be rational.KhalilurRahmanSo, You do not want to accept the first miracle of
Jesus at his infant ? Do not say Quran wrote stupid & nonsense. Prove it
with reference. Rather you people are trying to make the world fool by trying
to make a man God which is nothing but nonsense. Jesus is one of the mighty
messengers of God. But He is not God & He never claimed it.The
Evangelistic Ministry of AladesanmiAdeyemiWhat
you speak comes out of your nerven system, if the nerven system is in disorder
you cannot speak anything. Your nerven system is part of you, not the language
you speak out. The word you speak is what you learned; your ability to speak is
inborn. At the birth of Jesus, Angel were around to spread the good news to the
world, Jesus himself did nothing inhuman. Read the bible you will find all the
references there.
I understood your explanation. But it is not like
that. For example, my words are the expression of my desire & coming out of
me. But when these words are composed & made a book, this book does not
become equal to me. Bible contains many words of God, but it does not make
Bible a God. Same thing is valid for Spirit or Roh. I have Roh in me from God.
But it does not make me God or part of God. So far, I think, India has produced
the maximum number of Gods out of man. Their latest God was Bhagawan (God)
Rojonish who died few years back. He claimed that God has come to visit this
earth in the name of Rojonish..USA expelled him & many other countries did
not give him visa to enter. See the power of God. He has come to visit his own
created earth, but needed visa to enter into it & many places he could not
visit for not getting visa. What a mockery in the name of God.
The
Evangelistic Ministry of AladesanmiAdeyemi You still do
not understand. Any way it is impossible for a carnal mind to understand the
things of the spirit. A book written by you or someone else is only a
reproduction of speech. Your speech is a product of your word and your word is
part of you. The bible is a written inspired word
of God. The writer wrote as they were moved by God. But the very word they
heard is the word of God. Have you ever met someone who could hear God
speaking?. The word he heard could be directly from God. Your spirit comes from
the breadth of God. The breadth of God is but part of God. All this your
fantasy about Indian God is irrelevant to God of the bible. The whole biblical
mission was to make Jesus known. From Genesis to Revelation is all about Jesus.
Jesus is not just a prophet who appeared on the scene at his birth. All other
prophets had been talking about his coming.
Yes, all other prophets had been talking about the
coming of Jesus. But they also talked about coming of another prophet after
Jesus. People asked John-“Are you Masih, Ylyas or that Prophet?” (John
1:20-21). So, during the time of Jesus, Jews were waiting for another Prophet
other than Masih&Ilyas. Jesus also said-“ I have many thing to say, but you
cannot bear it now. When Comforter/Counselor will come, he will teach you
everything.” This Comforter is no body but that Prophet after Jesus, for whom Jews
are still waiting. You claim that this comforter is the Holy Spirit. Now tell
me what new things this Holy Spirit has taught you for last 2000 years which
Jesus did not tell you? Can you give me some specific lessons you received from
the Holy Spirit which is not there in your Bible?. It is also not clear how Holy Spirit teaches
you? Does he talk to you face to face or you meet him in dream or in
meditation. Or just you feel him in your heart & get inspiration. Please
clarify it, because clarification is required to understand the nature of true
Holy Spirit. Many of my Christian friends, including one Priest, told me that
different people get different types of solution from Holy Spirit for same
problem. So, what they are thinking as Holy Spirit may be their own desire
coming out from their subconscious mind.
The
Evangelistic Ministry of AladesanmiAdeyemi: My friend, I wonder how you read the bible and yet refused to
understand it. I have explained these phenomena before and I am not going to
repeat myself here.
Dear Sir, I have asked some specific question about
Holy Spirit in my last mail, but why you are avoiding it. You never explained
about Holy Spirit before. My other Christian friends also could not give any
clear picture about Holy Spirit. My question was: (1) what new things have been
taught to Christian World by Holy Spirit during last 2000 years. (2) How Holy
Spirit appears to you, face to face, in dream, in meditation or in some other
forms? Please give me some knowledge regarding this.
The
Evangelistic Ministry of AladesanmiAdeyemi : There is a lot of truth which the Holy Spirit revealed to the
Apostles which were not directly taught by Jesus. Read the Epistles and you
will find some of them. Holy Spirit is a spirit. You cannot see a spirit. You
can feel his presence, influence and his power.
Do you hear his voice?
If you do not see him, cannot speak to him & cannot hear his voice, how you
can receive his guidance. You can feel his presence only, it means it is only
your feelings that something may be around you. Whatever thought is coming in
your mind at that time, you think that it is from Holy Spirit. What a wishful
thinking? That is the reason that each person is getting different reply from
Holy Spirit for same question. Because, reply is coming from your own mind, not
from Holy Spirit. Normally people who do meditation can see & feel many
things which they take as the spiritual guidance. But it is not true.
You have to differentiate your own feeling from
divine feeling. The feeling originating from Holy Ghost is what we called
inspiration, impression or word of knowledge. It is usually the same.
Individual may ascribe different interpretation to
what they did not understand. The gifts of Holy Ghost are wisdom, miracle
power, healing. You can see vision through the Holy Ghost etc. There is also
the prophecy or gift of tongues when the Holy Ghost speaks through some one. We
do hear the audible voice of God through the Holy Ghost. Nevertheless Devil
could also put thought in some one mind.
Now I understand what you mean by Holy Ghost/Spirit.
This is nothing but your feelings when you are in meditation under the
influence of Holy Ghost or Devil. This phenomenon is also very old one. During
last 5000 years, many Hindu Sanyasis are doing many miracles & showing
powers acquired by meditation. People practicing black magic can also acquire
power through meditation & other methods, but they are certainly under the
influence of Devil. There are many Muslim Saints who acquired this type of
miraculous power & can see visions of future & can travels thousands of
miles in second. Now a day, many courses are available on meditation in
different countries which do not have any religious bearing. But if someone can
master those courses/methods, they can also show miracles. Main problem is that
you never know whether you are under the influence of Holy Ghost or under
Devil. Recently I had communications with another Christian group in face book.
They talk in such a filthy, abusing & pornographic language that I was
sure, they are under the influence of Devil. So, my friend, Jesus never talked
about this type of Comforter or Counselor. He had indicated to a Comforter who
is a man, but Messenger of God with the light of Truth. Please read your
scripture again & follow what Jesus said &come back to the real Truth.
Do not deceive yourself, your nation & the world with some wrong
interpretation. May God Almighty guide us to the Truth.
The
Evangelistic Ministry of AladesanmiAdeyemi : My friend, sorry to say
but you are yet to understand a simple writing. This is neither a meditation
nor your feeling. If you are filled with Holy Ghost you will know it. The power
of the Holy Ghost is also real.
The
Evangelistic Ministry of AladesanmiAdeyemi : Please, your ignorant is so absurd. I have posted the verse
on the comforter here. John14:16-17 –
“Then I will ask the Father, and he will give you another Advocate to be with
you forever – 17 the Spirit of truth, whom the world cannot accept, because it
does not see him or know him. But you know him, because he resides with you and
will be in you”.
The
Evangelistic Ministry of AladesanmiAdeyemi : Read again verse 26-
“But the Advocate, the Holy Spirit, whom the Father will send in my name, will
teach you everything, and will cause you to remember everything I said to
you”. And compare this with Acts 1.4
–While he was with them, he declared, “Do not leave Jerusalem, but wait there
for what my Father promised, which you heard about from me. John baptized with
water, but you will be baptized with the Holy Spirit not many days from now.”
The
Evangelistic Ministry of AladesanmiAdeyemi : Read again Acts1.8 –“
But you will receive power when the Holy Spirit has come upon you, and you will
be my witnesses in Jerusalem, and in all Judea and Samaria, and to the farthest
parts1 of the earth.”
The
Evangelistic Ministry of AladesanmiAdeyemi : Does your
intelligence tells you that this could be Mohammed?
KhalilurRahman: Certainly &
surely the Advocate or Counselor or Comforter about whom Jesus informed is no
body but Mohammad ( PBUH). I will justify it from your quotations as above. (1)
Jesus never said that this Advocate is Holy Spirit. Rather, his way of talking
indicates that this Advocate is a man. (2) The Spirit of Truth : All the Messengers of God are having the
Spirit of Truth during their times. Abraham, Moses, Noh, David, Jesus &
other Messengers did have the Spirit of Truth. This Advocate is also a
Messenger of God & will have Spirit of Truth. (3) This Advocate to be with
you forever---His teachings will remain forever, it means he is the last
Messenger of God & Qur'an is the last Testament. No other Messenger will
come to update it. (4) Will teach you everything, and will cause you to
remember everything--- This is very much true for Qur'an. Thousands of Muslim
has memorized Qur'an from A-Z in all the ages. Even today, you will find
thousand of them all over the world who can recite Qur'an blind folded from the
beginning to the end from their memory. We call them Hafiz-e-Qur'an. It is
unique. Can you show a single person who can recite whole Bible from his
memory? God has made this arrangement to protect the Qur'an. Nobody can alter
even a single letter from Qur'an. (5) Do not leave Jerusalem---Jesus instructed
you not to leave Jerusalem because he knew that this Spirit of Truth will enter
Jerusalem, and then to all Judea & Samaria & then farthest part of the
earth. Exactly same thing happened with Islam. But you did not obey what Jesus
said. You shifted your Centre from Jerusalem to Rome. Result is, most of the
Christians did not have opportunity to accept the Spirit of Truth or Islam.
Dear friend, if you read Qur'an with an open mind, all these things will be
very clear to you. You will find how Qur'an has glorified Jesus & his mother
Mary. May God guide us to real truth.
The
Evangelistic Ministry of AladesanmiAdeyemi@rahman: how can a man
be so stupid and argues blindly. In the above
quoted verses you could still not understand simple statement
like"John14.26:But the Advocate, the Holy Spirit, whom the Father will
send in my name, will teach you everything, and will cause you to remember
everything I said to you. "17
hours ago ·
KhalilurRahmanMy Dear Friend, Firstly, in this verse, Holy Spirit
is not mentioned anywhere to replace Advocate or Comforter or Counselor. Do you
want to add it from yourself to suit your explanation? The Spirit of Truth is
there which I explained before. "And will cause you to remember everything
I said to you"- This sentence is also applicable only for Mohammad (PBUH).
He has reminded the world/you same thing which Jesus said to you. Examine these
two verses of Bible:John 20:17, Jesus said “ I am going up to Him who is my God & your God”.
Mark 12:29-32, Jesus said “Lord, our God, is one. And love him with all your heart, life, mind & strength and love your neighbor”. And they said -“Yes, you are correct. There is no God except Him”.
We also say the same thing- "There is only one God who is your Lord & our Lord. He is the God of Abraham, Moses, David, Jesus & Mohammad (Peace be upon all of them”
·
·
The
Evangelistic Ministry of AladesanmiAdeyemi if
you have understanding and have read your bible very well. You will note that
the comforter or the advocate is on the Holy Spirit. Again read acts
1.8"But you will receive power when the Holy Spirit has come upon you, and
you will be my witnesses in Jerusalem, and in all Judea and Samaria, and to the
farthest parts1 of the earth.”
·
KhalilurRahman The
concept of Trinity, Holy Spirit, Crossetc are the developments made by Paul
& other Disciples of Jesus after his departure. Act & other books after
Jesus are written to establish the concepts of Trinity & Holy Spirit. So,
your quotation from Act is not reliable. Please quote from 4 Gospels & from
Old Testament to show that Jesus said that the Holy Spirit &
Comforter/Advocate/Counselor are same. You cannot show it. It means they are
not same. You previously told that Jesus will sit on the same throne of God. It
is also not there in Gospels. Paul & others had seen it in their visions
which are not reliable at all. Vision may be inspired by a spirit or a devil as
you said it earlier.
·
The
Evangelistic Ministry of AladesanmiAdeyemi : My friend
with all respect, I have no time for stupid debate. The earlier quotation was
from the gospel of John. You seem to be a man who delights not in knowing the
truth but only in blind argument. See again John14.verse 26:"But the
Advocate, the Holy Spirit, whom the Father will send in my name, will teach you
everything, and will cause you to remember everything I said to you."
·
KhalilurRahman My
friend, I am not doing any blind argument. Please see John 14:16-17 also. It is
written-The friend you will get is the Spirit of Truth. Now the question is
whether he is Holy Spirit or spirit of truth. Many other places in Bible, including
in Revelation, the spirit of truth is meant for the Messengers of God. After
lot of interpolation & revision, you have made Bible so much contradicting
that it is very difficult to get real truth out of it.
·
The
Evangelistic Ministry of AladesanmiAdeyemi : If your argument is not blind why
can't you understand a simple statement. It is called the spirit of the truth.
Jesus is the Truth. It is therefore the spirit of Christ. The Holy Spirit is
the spirit of the truth. Jesus is the one baptizing in the holy spirit.
·
The
Evangelistic Ministry of AladesanmiAdeyemi : In
John 14.17 "but ye know him; for hedwelleth with you, and shall be in you.
" This cannot be human being
·
KhalilurRahman Your
arguments are all confusing. You said Spirit of Truth is Spirit of Jesus. Again
Holy Spirit is also same as the Spirit of Truth. So, Holy Spirit is nothing but
spirit of Jesus. So, Holy Spirit does not have any separate entity. Jesus &
Holy Spirit becomes one entity. Now, Trinity does not stand any more. It
becomes Duality. God the Father & the Son with his spirit. You also said
that only Jesus is the Truth. It is not correct. There are many others who are
also called Truth. Please read Revelation 19:11. A white Horse & its Rider.
The Rider is called Faithful & True. Certainly this Rider is not Jesus.
Because Jesus has already landed in Zion. You said before, Jesus will judge the
people & punish them. It is also not correct. Please read Revelation 20:11-15
to know how the Judgment will be made. He will sit on a Great White Throne
& judge the people. It is no where mentioned that this man is Jesus. In
four Gospels also, Jesus never said that He will judge the people on the day of
Judgment.
There
is nothing confusing in this. Jesus is the word of God. The Holy Spirit is the
breadth of God. All what belong to the father belong to the son. The Father and
the son are one. So is the spirit and the son are one. the father and the son and the spirit are one. Holy Spirit is the spirit of
the father and of the son. The word is the word of the father and of the son
and of the spirit. The man in Rev 19.11 is Jesus. He is called the truth and
his name is the word of God (vs.13). The Man on the white throne is Jesus
(rev.20.11-15). Read the gospel very well. Jesus often spoke that he will judge
the people on the last day.
·
KhalilurRahman I
understand your mind set. You cannot think anything else except Trinity. You
cannot interpret the Bible with an open mind. All the books after Gospel has
been written to establish Trinity & you are explaining them also to
establish Trinity. You are claiming that all characters mentioned in Revelation
are nobody but Jesus. But a third party who is studying Bible with open mind
will not think so. Jesus is mentioned as Lamb in this chapter. There are many
other characters also in this chapter who are not Jesus. There are four
distinct characters who are coming to this earth during three different time
period. One man sitting on a white horse with bow & arrow as his weapon
coming & conquering east & west ( Rev 6:1-2). Another man, also on a
white horse, coming to this earth. But his weapon is fire &sulpher with
huge sound & destroying miles after miles in one burst. Then the beast
coming from the sea with similar power & fighting with the righteous people
of God ( Rev 13:1-10). Finally Jesus is coming from the sky with angels &
landing on mount Zion. They are so obvious & clear. But you are claiming
all of them as Jesus which is not
possible.
·
KhalilurRahman Another
problem is that the Christian people do always depend on Holy Spirit. They take
all decisions, for worldly affairs or for religious matter, from the
inspiration of Holy Spirit. But it is never sure whether the inspiration is
coming from Holy Spirit or from Devil. Result is that they take mostly wrong or
unjust decision in the name of Holy Spirit.
·
KhalilurRahman Wrong
interpretation of Revelation is creating all these present problems in Middle
East. All Christian people know that the Great War between Jesus &
Anti-Christ will be fought in Middle Eastern area. Now they are trying to
occupy the whole Middle East & create a situation so that Jesus can land
there safely & join them to fight Anti-Christ. But they are mistaken to
decide who Anti-Christ is. To decide about Anti-Christ, we have to study &
understand Revelation very carefully. All Christian people will agree that Jews
are one of the parties of Anti-Christ. They are the only nation who opposed
Jesus very strongly & tried to kill him on a cross. Even today, they do not
have belief in Jesus. Bible says that son of Jacob (Israel) will be heavily
persecuted during this war. Two third of them will be killed during this war
& remaining one third will accept the truth after this war. It means there
will be no existence of Jew after this war. So, it is very clear that Jews are
Anti-Christ & Jesus will fight them. Now, any nation who takes Jews as
friend & join them in this fight will be also a party of Anti-Christ &
they will be also eliminated in this war. Almost all Western nations,
especially USA, have taken Israel as friend & they together are conducting
war in Middle East. Don't you think that they have taken the party of
Anti-Christ? Second point which is to be considered is the Beast of Bible. All
Christian agree that the Beast is Anti-Christ. The Beast will come out of the
ocean (Rev 13:1-9) & fight the righteous people of Middle East. This Beast
will also try to kill the Righteous boy who was born in the Middle East (Rev
12:1-6). Now you can easily find out who is this Beast. Who are the nations
coming out of the sea, joining with Israel & fighting the righteous people
of Middle East. Jesus will come & join the righteous people of Middle East
& kill this Beast & Jews.
·
KhalilurRahman : Sometimes
back you told me that you do not know anything about Nostradamus. Below is some
information about him taken from Wikipedia- "Michel de Nostredame[1] (14
or 21 December 1503[2] – 2 July 1566), usually Latinised to Nostradamus, was a
French apothecary and reputed seer who published collections of prophecies that
have since become famous worldwide. He is best known for his book Les
Propheties (The Prophecies), the first edition of which appeared in 1555. Since
the publication of this book, which has rarely been out of print since his
death, Nostradamus has attracted a following that, along with the popular
press, credits him with predicting many major world events.
Most academic sources maintain that the associations made between world events and Nostradamus's quatrains are largely the result of misinterpretations or mistranslations (sometimes deliberate) or else are so tenuous as to render them useless as evidence of any genuine predictive power.[3] Nevertheless, occasional commentators have successfully used a process of free interpretation and determined 'twisting' of their words to predict an apparently imminent event. In 1867, three years before it happened, for example, Le Pelletier did so to anticipate either the triumph or the defeat of Napoleon III in a war that, in the event, begged to be identified as the Franco-Prussian war, while admitting that he could not specify either which or when.[4
Most academic sources maintain that the associations made between world events and Nostradamus's quatrains are largely the result of misinterpretations or mistranslations (sometimes deliberate) or else are so tenuous as to render them useless as evidence of any genuine predictive power.[3] Nevertheless, occasional commentators have successfully used a process of free interpretation and determined 'twisting' of their words to predict an apparently imminent event. In 1867, three years before it happened, for example, Le Pelletier did so to anticipate either the triumph or the defeat of Napoleon III in a war that, in the event, begged to be identified as the Franco-Prussian war, while admitting that he could not specify either which or when.[4
Note
:- At this stage, The Evangelistic Ministry stopped all types of communications
with me. They did not reply my last 4 letters. I also decided not to bother
them anymore. They cannot satisfy anybody with their reasoning &
justifications because they do not go with the real teachings of Bible.
However, I find another group of Christians who are willing to discuss with
me through emails only. I accepted their
proposals & started talking to them. It is in the PART-II of this book.
PART-II
When The
Evangellistics Ministry stopped all communication with me, I started looking
for other organizations in face book who intends to discuss with me on
Christianity. I found a web page named godlife.com who is interested on
discussion; but not on face book. They wanted to communicate with email only. I
agreed & sent a mail to them. Mr. Donald from godlife.com started replied
& the strings of communications started with them as coming to the
following pages.
To:
khalil@optimaxbd.net
Subject:
fb-godlife.com: Jesus did not say that He will die on cross to pay for your
sin. Please quote where he said this.
|
Dear
Khalilur,
Thank you
for taking the time to send us an email. You will receive a reply from one of
our caring volunteers who will pray for you, answer any questions and provide
suggestions on ways to get closer to God.The Bible tells us "If we draw
near to God, He will draw near to us" (James 4:8). You can start growing
in your relationship with God right now.
Please do not respond to this message. One of our volunteers will
email you shortly.
|
At 12:46 PM 5/12/2012,
connect@godlife.com
wrote:(KJV)
John 3: 14 And as Moses lifted up
the serpent in the wilderness, even so must the Son of man be lifted up: 15
That whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have eternal life. Look
into the scriptures where Moses lifted up the serpent and you will see there a
perfect picture of the judgment of God and His deliverance for those who
believe. It is in Numbers 21: 5-9 :Believe
and see. Taste and see that the lord is good! Blessed is the one who puts their
trust in Him!
KHALILUR RAHMAN
Thank you very much for your reply. I
had a very specific question. I asked whether Jesus did say anywhere in Bible
that he will die on a cross to pay for our sins. You did not touch this point
in your reply. Please give specific reply quoting from Bible. Secondly, you
talked about the Son of Man who comes down from heaven, he should be lifted up
& to be believed to get eternal life. Who is this Son of Man? Surely he is
not Jesus, because you call Jesus as begotten Son of God. I ask you who is this
Son of Man.?I hope I will get your reply by return mail.
At 11:37 AM 5/14/2012, connect@godlife.com wrote:
At 11:37 AM 5/14/2012, connect@godlife.com wrote:
Dear
Khalilur,
Your
questions seem to be leading. That is, by asking " where did Jesus say He
would die on the cross for our sins" you don't seem to be asking to
understand, but to look for holes in the Christian assertions on Who Jesus is
and what He came to do. He also never said He was a great teacher, but there's
no question that He was. The Bible is replete with the account of Who Jesus was
and why He came. I don't understand why you rejected the scripture about Him
being lifted up, but I'll give you a few more:(KJV) Mark 10:45 For even the Son
of man came not to be ministered unto, but to minister, and to give his life a
ransom for many.
Ok, here Jesus said He came to GIVE HIS LIFE AS A RANSOM. what does this mean to you?
(KJV) John 6:51 I am the living bread which came down from heaven: if any man eat of this bread, he shall live forever: and the bread that I will give is my flesh, which I will give for the life of the world. Here Jesus said He came to give His flesh for us to eat, what does this mean to you?
Ok, here Jesus said He came to GIVE HIS LIFE AS A RANSOM. what does this mean to you?
(KJV) John 6:51 I am the living bread which came down from heaven: if any man eat of this bread, he shall live forever: and the bread that I will give is my flesh, which I will give for the life of the world. Here Jesus said He came to give His flesh for us to eat, what does this mean to you?
So, now then, you ask, Did Jesus ever
say...." my answer is, yes and absolutely. You see, the entire Bible is
God breathed and Jesus being God is the author of the Book that tells us . Who
He is. Jesus calls Himself both the Son of God AND the Son of man, because He
is God who became flesh and dwelt among us......You see, He came to give us who
are dead in our sins, new life. True life. He defined eternal life in John 17:3 as
this: ' and this is eternal life, to know thee, the only true God and Jesus Christ
whom you have sent." Do you KNOW God? Jesus came, died and rose from the
dead so you could! He is coming again, not as savior, but as judge. Those who
reject Him now, will be judged later. For now, He waits and calls to them, that
they might be saved.
KHALILUR
RAHMAN
Thanks
for your reply. You said I am asking question to look for holes in Christian
assertion. Let me clarify some points. I am not a Christian. But I am looking
for the truth in your religion. I started with Old & New Testament. But I
found them so much contradictory to each other that I am totally confused. Even
the 4 gospel of New Testaments is totally opposite to the teaching of present
Church. There are problems with translation also. Each translation is different
from another one. Even the translation in same language is also different from
publishers to publishers. Bengali Translation in India is different from that
of Bangladesh. It is really a hodgepodge. People are playing with this religion
so much that it is very difficult to find out the truth. That is the reason I
need the explanation from an expert like you. If you are ready to satisfy my
queries, I can proceed further.
If
you are unwilling or unable, I have to stop here. Please let me know your
intention.
At 10:23 AM 5/16/2012, connect@godlife.com wrote:
At 10:23 AM 5/16/2012, connect@godlife.com wrote:
Dear
Khalilur,
It
is good to hear that you are truly seeking the Truth and I am glad to give you
whatever help I can. The first thing you need to know is this: I am not here to
defend the Bible, God, Jesus or Christianity. God does not need defending. He
simply is. WE need help. We might not realize it, but that doesn't make it any
less true. Do you know God? I do. At one time, I didn't know God, but now I do.
The reason I start here, is that this is where I began. I wasn't born a
Christian. I was raised a nominal Catholic, who didn't actually believe in
Jesus. I believed many things over the first 20 years of my life, but I came to
the point where I simply asked this question of God: "If you are my
Father, why don't I know you? Either you don't exist, or what Jesus said is
true, that I am NOT a child of God".
So, from there I chose to believe what the
Christians said about Jesus, that He died for my sins and rose from the dead. I
realize now, that at that moment, my life began. He honored His promise that
whoever believes in Him should not perish by have everlasting life. By
definition in John 17:3, Jesus said 'and this is eternal life to know thee, the
ONLY true God and Jesus Christ whom thou hast sent". I was born again and
now I know God. It's as simple as that. Now, I must ask you again, do you know
God? If not, why not? Have you ever asked yourself that question? So, what
questions do you have specifically? What contradictions do you find in the
Bible? Feel free to ask me any question. I am here to help. I don't have all
the answers, but I do know the One who does!
KHALILUR
RAHMAN
Thanks
for your reply. I am happy that you are with me. I hope you will not be tired
of my questions. Let us start from the basic. We all know that Christianity is
the continuation of Judaism. Judaism was the only known religion of the world
which very honestly & earnestly was practicing Monotheism. Starting from
the days of Abraham, Isaac, Jacob, Josef, Moses , David till the days of Jesus,
this religion was under direct supervision of God. They very strictly maintained
the worship of One Supreme God. Any time they deviated from this path, they
were punished & brought back to the path of Monotheism again.. Bible
says-"Your God is very jealous God. So, worship no body except Him".
Whole Old Testament upholds this Monotheism without any exception. Till now, I
did not have any access to Talmud of Jews. I think it is much more strict
towards Monotheism. New Testament also, up to the days of Jesus, more or less,
was maintaining Monotheism. But the picture is totally changed after the
departure of Jesus from this world. Paul who was one of the staunched enemies
of Jesus & some other disciple of Jesus, started talking about three Gods.
They developed the concept of Trinity, God the Father, God the Son & Holy
Ghost. I think, they developed this concept to face some of the questions of
Jews. We know that Jesus did not have any father. Paul & other disciples,
may be, ashamed of this fact that Jesus did not have father. So, they started
talking that God is his father & Jesus is begotten son of God. As he is
begotten son, so he is the part of God also. In other words, Jesus is also God.
Then why this God died on a cross? Jews used to think that death on a cross is
most heinous, criminal & cursed death. To overcome this question, Paul
started preaching that Jesus died on a cross to pay for the sin of all mankind.
From then, Cross became the symbol of Christianity. Please note that the name
Christian is also not given by Jesus. It is from Paul. Jews knew that another
Messenger of God will be coming after Jesus. Jesus also predicted about that
Messenger of God. In Latin version of Bible, this Messenger is called Periclitos. It is translated in
English as Comforter, Counselor, Advocate, Helper &some times Spirit of
Truth. Different people used different words for Periclitos. Paul preached that
this counselor is nothing but the holy ghost who will come to your mind &
inspire you. Thus Holy Ghost also became a part of God & finally became a
God. This is, in short, the history of evolution how Monotheism has become
Polytheism. There are some Christian groups also who believes Mary as one of
the Gods as well. History of Trinity is there in Hinduism also. They have
Brahma, Wisnu& Shiva. Three Gods looking after three different affairs of this
universe. However, Monotheism is again back with the emergence of Islam. Islam
is even much more stronger than Jews regarding the concept of One Supreme God
Almighty.
Dear Donald, that is my basic introduction about how Christianity developed from strict Monotheism to Polytheism. We will discuss further after I receive your views on this.
At
11:32 AM 5/19/2012, you wrote:
Dear Khalilur,
I’m going to respond to your
questions, line by line. I think this would be the most accurate way to deal
with each of them. I pray God’s peace upon you.
Your wrote: “We all know that
Christianity is the continuation of Judaism.” This is not an accurate
statement. “Christianity” is just a general label for those who name the name
of Christ. It is not a ‘continuation of Judaism’, but the actual original
purpose for Judaism. Christ is the Savior of the World. God has clearly said
that ‘the soul that sins, it shall die’. He warned Adam and Eve not to eat of
the tree of knowledge of good and evil, saying: ‘in the day you eat of it, you
shall die’. He then cursed the woman, the man and the serpent. The curse to the
serpent went like this: ‘And I will put enmity between you and the woman, And
between your seed and her Seed; He shall bruise your head, And you shall bruise
His heel’. Jesus is the seed of the Woman spoken of here. Jesus was ‘bruised’
on the cross and the devil’s power (his head was ‘bruised’, the head represents
power, authority). When Adam and Eve sinned, they turned over the authority of
their lives and the entire earth to Satan. By obeying him, they became his
slaves and we ourselves, as their offspring were born in their image, fallen
from God and slaves of the devil. Sin is our natural state of being. We are
desperately wicked, but Jesus came to deliver us from this evil. He did so by
becoming the substitutionary lamb for us.
If you actually study Judaism, you
will see that God instituted many different types of sacrifices, including the
slaughter of bulls and lambs for the covering of the sins of the people of
Israel. All of these were instituted by God to teach the Jewish people and as
an example for us other nations of the coming of the Messiah, Jesus.
God made it abundantly clear, over
and over, that without the shedding of blood, there can be no remission for
sin.
It is a right assertion that those
who sin must die, as you alluded to, but you cannot forget who God declared
Himself to be when He appeared to Moses. "(6) And the LORD passed before
him and proclaimed, "The LORD, the LORD God, merciful and gracious,
longsuffering, and abounding in goodness and truth, (7) "keeping mercy for
thousands, forgiving iniquity and transgression and sin, by no means clearing
the guilty, visiting the iniquity of the fathers upon the children and the
children's children to the third and the fourth generation."" - (Exd
34:6-7 NKJV)
Notice that God does not ‘clear the
guilty’. How can He do this and yet ‘ forgiveinquity and transgression and
sin’? Only by the shedding of INNOCENT blood.
He had them kill innocent lambs,
bulls, turtledoves and goats, all as symbols of the ultimate sacrifice that He
Himself would make.
….”He gave His Only begotten Son,
that whosoever believes in Him would not perish by have everlasting life”.
(John 3:16).
You wrote: “New Testament also, up
to the days of Jesus, more or less, was maintaining Monotheism. But the picture
is totally changed after the departure of Jesus from this world. Paul who was
one of the staunched enemies of Jesus & some other disciple of Jesus,
started talking about three Gods. They developed the concept of Trinity, God
the Father, God the Son & Holy Ghost. I think, they developed this concept
to face some of the questions of Jews. We know that Jesus did not have any
father. Paul & other disciples, may be, ashamed of this fact that Jesus did
not have father. So, they started talking that God is his father & Jesus is
begotten son of God.”
I see that you believe that the teaching
of the Trinity is only in the New Testament, but as I demonstrated here, the
New Testament is the fulfillment of the Old Testament, not a completely new
religion. Christ came to be the lamb of God. If you actually study the Old
Testament you see that God often refers to Himself as ‘us’. In Genesis He said
“let US make man in OUR image”. Only God is the CREATOR, correct? Yes, of
course. Only He could be the Creator. If you look, then, at the “New”
Testament, in Colossians 1: 16 you read this “For by Him all things werecreated
that are in heaven and that are on earth, visible and invisible, whether
thrones or dominions or principalities or powers. All things werecreated
through Him and for Him.” This is obviously God, for only He is the Creator, do
you agree?
Now look at this entire passage:
Colossians 1: 17-20: "And He is before all things, and in Him all things
consist.""And He is the head of the body, the church, who is the
beginning, the firstborn from the dead, that in all things He may have the
preeminence.""For it pleased the Father that in Him all the fullness
should dwell,""and by Him to reconcile all things to Himself, by Him,
whether things on earth or things in heaven, having made peace through the
blood of His cross."
As you can see, this passage is
clearly saying that Jesus is the Creator, who is God and that the Father is
also God.
Now, I know that you believe that
Paul was making up that God was Jesus’ father because he was embarrassed that
the one he called messiah had no father, but that’s just simply not true.
Let me point to what Jesus said
about Himself in the book of John: (This is kind of long…..)
John 6:32-58: "Then Jesus said
to them, "Most assuredly, I say to you, Moses did not give you the bread
from heaven, but My Father gives you the true bread from heaven. For the bread
of God is He who comes down from heaven and gives life to the world. Then they
said to Him, "Lord, give us this bread always.""
"And Jesus said to them,
"I am the bread of life. He who comes to Me shall never hunger, and he who
believes in Me shall never thirst. But I said to you that you have seen Me and
yet do not believe. All that the Father gives Me will come to Me, and the one
who comes to Me I will by no means cast out. For I have come down from heaven,
not to do My own will, but the will of Him who sent Me. This is the will of the
Father who sent Me, that of all He has given Me I should lose nothing, but
should raise it up at the last day. And this is the will of Him who sent Me,
that everyone who sees the Son and believes in Him may have everlasting life;
and I will raise him up at the last day. The Jews then complained about Him,
because He said, "I am the bread which came down from heaven. And they
said, "Is not this Jesus, the son of Joseph, whose father and mother we
know? How is it then that He says, 'I have come down from heaven'?""
Jesus therefore answered and said to them, "Do not murmur among
yourselves.”No one can come to Me unless the Father who sent Me draws him; and
I will raise him up at the last day. It is written in the prophets, 'And they
shall all be taught by God.' Therefore everyone who has heard and learned from
the Father comes to Me. "Not that anyone has seen the Father, except He
who is from God; He has seen the Father.”Most assuredly, I say to you, he who
believes in Me has everlasting life. "I am the bread of life."Your
fathers ate the manna in the wilderness, and are dead. "This is the bread
which comes down from heaven, that one may eat of it and not die."I am the
living bread which came down from heaven. If anyone eats of this bread, he will
live forever; and the bread that I shall give is My flesh, which I shall give
for the life of the world.” The Jews therefore quarreled among themselves,
saying, "How can this Man give us His flesh to eat?" Then Jesus said
to them, "Most assuredly, I say to you, unless you eat the flesh of the
Son of Man and drink His blood, you have no life in you. "Whoever eats My
flesh and drinks My blood has eternal life, and I will raise him up at the last
day."
"For My flesh is food indeed,
and My blood is drink indeed."He who eats My flesh and drinks My blood
abides in Me, and I in him. "As the living Father sent Me, and I live
because of the Father, so he who feeds on Me will live because of Me.
"This is the bread which came down from heaven--not as your fathers ate
the manna, and are dead. He who eats this bread will live forever.""
Ok, I’ll leave off here and get back
to you later about your other questions. I hope you respond and let me know you
think about the things I’ve written.
KHALILUR RAHMAN
Thanks for your reply. I
will also discuss each of them one by one. There is no doubt that Jesus was a
Jew. He was born in Jewish family & brought up also as per Jew tradition.
Even he was circumcised on 8th day of his birth. After he was baptized by John
he started preaching the messages of God. But he said very categorically that
he has come to strengthen the Laws of Moses. Mathew 5:17-20- “ Do
not think that I come to destroy the Law and commandments of Moses, but to
strengthen them”. Mathew
18:16-21- “ People asked-How to get eternal life in Heaven. Jesus said-
"Obey the Commandments of God”.
Mathew 23:2-3 -“Do what you are told to follow the
laws of Moses”. Luke 16:29 - “ For salvation, give attention to
the books of Moses & Prophets”. John 3: 4-5 “ Sin is to disobey
laws & Commandments”. So, it is so obvious that his mission was to
strengthen the Laws of Moses & thereby give salvation to the people. Most
interesting is that he came only for the people of Israel. He did not
come for whole world., he did not come for you & me.
Mathew 15:24 - “ Jesus said-I am sent only to the lost
sheep of Israel”. He never preached among Non-Jew people & instructed his
disciple also not to go to Non-Jew. Mathew 10:5-7-“ Do not go to Non-Jew
and the village of Samaria . Only go to the lost sheep of Israel”. He
even refused to cure any non-Jew patients. When a Samarian woman approached him
for her daughter, Jesus refused by saying- ( Mathew 15:26 ) “
It is not good to give the food of Children to dogs”. So, if you are not a Jew,
you are like a dog in their eyes. The quotations of New Testament as above
certainly proves that Jesus came only for the people of Israel. His teachings,
his sayings, his actions & his life, all are for the people of Israel. He
was the Messenger of God coming for the lost sheep of Israel. He came to put
them on right path again. In that sense, he was the continuation of Judaism.
God cursed Adam, Eve &
Serpent. But Adam & Eve repented for their mistakes & they were
forgiven by God from their sin. Satan did not repent & he will remain
cursed till the day of Judgment. Not only Jesus, we all are the seeds of this
Man & Woman. We have the nature to commit sin. But a sin will be committed
only when we disobey God.
Jesus said in John 3: 4-5 “ Sin is to
disobey laws & Commandments”. But after committing a sin, if a person
repents & ask forgiveness to God, he will be forgiven by God. You
said 'Bruised' is meant for Jesus. I did not find it any where. May be it
is the explanation of your Church.
Sacrifice is there in all religions. You have to sacrifice your loved one in the path of God to show your love for God. Every man loves his wealth. In old age, wealth means how many cattle you have, how many lambs, sheep or goats you have. That’s why God ordered to sacrifice animals. In other words, this sacrifice will decrease your love towards worldly materials & increase love for God. When Abraham was ordered to sacrifice his most loved one, he thought his most loved one is his first born son. When he was about to sacrifice his first son Ishmael, God stopped him & replaced him by a lamb. God never allowed anybody to sacrifice a man for his sin. There is another point. Who is required to make this sacrifice? A person who commits sin, has to sacrifice his own wealth & ask forgiveness from God. If I commit a sin & you do sacrifice your wealth or life for me, I will never be forgiven. I have to make my own sacrifice from my loved one. Thus, Sacrifice of Jesus life on cross will not save other people from their sin.
You have referred from "Colossians". Who has written this book? It is written after Trinity is declared by Church. Naturally they tried to prove Jesus as God in this book to uphold their concept of Trinity. Presently, let us consider only on those facts what Jesus preached to his disciples. Later on, we will discuss about other books.
Sacrifice is there in all religions. You have to sacrifice your loved one in the path of God to show your love for God. Every man loves his wealth. In old age, wealth means how many cattle you have, how many lambs, sheep or goats you have. That’s why God ordered to sacrifice animals. In other words, this sacrifice will decrease your love towards worldly materials & increase love for God. When Abraham was ordered to sacrifice his most loved one, he thought his most loved one is his first born son. When he was about to sacrifice his first son Ishmael, God stopped him & replaced him by a lamb. God never allowed anybody to sacrifice a man for his sin. There is another point. Who is required to make this sacrifice? A person who commits sin, has to sacrifice his own wealth & ask forgiveness from God. If I commit a sin & you do sacrifice your wealth or life for me, I will never be forgiven. I have to make my own sacrifice from my loved one. Thus, Sacrifice of Jesus life on cross will not save other people from their sin.
You have referred from "Colossians". Who has written this book? It is written after Trinity is declared by Church. Naturally they tried to prove Jesus as God in this book to uphold their concept of Trinity. Presently, let us consider only on those facts what Jesus preached to his disciples. Later on, we will discuss about other books.
Now I will reply to the last
portion of your reply. You said in Colossians 1: 17-20: it is clearly
saying that Jesus is the Creator, who is God and that the Father is also God.
This is the claim by the people who wrote Colossians after Jesus. Jesus never
said that he is the creator. It is nowhere in Old Testament also that Jesus is
the Creator.
Then you referred from John 6:32-58. It is about the miracle of Jesus with bread. To get a clear picture we should read from verse 6:10. They have only five breads & two fishes. Jesus prayed to God & then distributed these bread & 2 fishes among about 5000 people. All these people ate these & satisfied their hunger. When many other people came to know about this miracle, they came to meet him when Jesus delivered this sermon which you referred in John 6:26-58. He said- "Why you are looking for a food which is perishable. Son of Man will provide you the food which gives you eternal life ( John6:27). Please note here, Jesus is calling himself as the Son of Man, not Son of God. Jesus further said- You have to believe him whom God has sent (John 6:29). Here again Jesus told them that he is sent by God. Finally he declared that he is that bread of life. Anybody believing him will have eternal life & will not have hunger & thirst in the life hereafter.. He also told them that he did not come to work as par his own whim, but to accomplish the will of the God who has sent him ( John 6:38). Jesus said, who so ever eat his flesh & drink his blood will have eternal life. What does it mean to eat flesh & drink blood? Does it mean eating physically? Is it possible to eat real flesh of Jesus. Did you ever eat it yourself.
Then you referred from John 6:32-58. It is about the miracle of Jesus with bread. To get a clear picture we should read from verse 6:10. They have only five breads & two fishes. Jesus prayed to God & then distributed these bread & 2 fishes among about 5000 people. All these people ate these & satisfied their hunger. When many other people came to know about this miracle, they came to meet him when Jesus delivered this sermon which you referred in John 6:26-58. He said- "Why you are looking for a food which is perishable. Son of Man will provide you the food which gives you eternal life ( John6:27). Please note here, Jesus is calling himself as the Son of Man, not Son of God. Jesus further said- You have to believe him whom God has sent (John 6:29). Here again Jesus told them that he is sent by God. Finally he declared that he is that bread of life. Anybody believing him will have eternal life & will not have hunger & thirst in the life hereafter.. He also told them that he did not come to work as par his own whim, but to accomplish the will of the God who has sent him ( John 6:38). Jesus said, who so ever eat his flesh & drink his blood will have eternal life. What does it mean to eat flesh & drink blood? Does it mean eating physically? Is it possible to eat real flesh of Jesus. Did you ever eat it yourself.
Jews did not understand this phrase. I have
heard that Christians do take bread & wine from their priest & eat it
as the symbol of flesh & blood of Jesus. I think Christians also did not
understand this phrase. Jesus already clarified it in John 6:35-36. Who so ever
believe in Jesus, he gets that bread of life & does not have thirst
& hunger. He will be lifted alive on Final Day ( John 6:40).. So, eating of
flesh & blood means accepting Jesus in totality & follow his teachings.
Discussion as above shows that Jesus talked just like any other Prophets or
Messengers of God, like Abraham, Moses, David & others. He was sent by God
to Jews to fulfill the will of God & to show the path of eternal life like
other prophets before him.
I have received your another mail. I will reply tomorrow.
At 11:58 AM 5/20/2012, you wrote:
Hello! I will continue here before I hear
back from my last writing so I can finish answering this first list of
questions:I have received your another mail. I will reply tomorrow.
At 11:58 AM 5/20/2012, you wrote:
You wrote: “As he is begotten son, so he is the part of God also. In other words, Jesus is also
God. Then why this God died on a cross? Jews used to think that death on a cross is most heinous, criminal & cursed death.” Yes, they did, and do you know why? Because it is written in the old testament: ‘Deuteronomy " 21: 22-23 "If a man has committed a sin deserving of death, and he is put to death, and you hang him on a tree, his body shall not remain overnight on the tree, but you shall surely bury him that day, so that you do not defile the land which the LORD your God is giving you as an inheritance; for he who is hanged is accursed of God."
When God cursed mankind in the garden of Eden, how could they ever be delivered from that curse?
Look at the New Testament where this verse from Deuteronomy was repeated and more fully revealed:
Gal. 3:13 & 14 "Christ has redeemed us from the curse of the law, having become a curse for us (for it is written, "Cursed is everyone who hangs on a tree" )," that the blessing of Abraham might come upon the Gentiles in Christ Jesus, that we might receive the promise of the Spirit through faith."
Read that again: ‘that the blessing of Abraham might come upon the Gentiles in Christ Jesus’. What blessing in Abraham? The one I spoke about in my last email: "In your seed all the nations of the earth shall be blessed, because you have obeyed My voice."" Gen 22:18
So, the Christ, is God incarnate, who hung on a tree that the sins of all who would trust in His finished work on that cross might be freed from the curse of sin and death.
Ok, on to your next question:
You wrote: “Jews knew that another Messenger of God will be coming after Jesus. Jesus also predicted about that Messenger of God. In Latin version of Bible, this Messenger is called Periclitos. It is translated in English as Comforter, Counselor, Advocate, Helper &some times Spirit of Truth. Different people useddifferent words for Periclitos. Paul preached that this counselor is nothing but the holy ghost who will come to your mind & inspire you. Thus Holy Ghost also became a part of God & finally became a God. This is, in short, the history of evolution how a Monotheism has become Polytheism.”
Jesus spoke of sending someone when He left. That ‘messenger’ Jesus called “The Spirit of Truth” in John 15:26 "But when the Helper comes, whom I shall send to you from the Father, the Spirit of truth who proceeds from the Father, He will testify of Me.”
Notice here, that in the Gospel of John, Jesus says that the messenger to follow, is someone that HE HIMSELF would send. That person, that messenger who He sent was the Spirit of God, The Spirit of Truth. Interesting, because Jesus called Himself “the Way, the Truth and the Life”, so He equates the Spirit of Truth with Himself. Interesting, have you ever wondered why?
It is because Jesus, the Father and the Spirit are the ONE God. This is not polytheism. Polytheism is having multiple Gods. The Bible is clear that God is One. It is written in Deuteronomy 6:4 "Hear, O Israel: The LORD our God, the LORD [is] one!”
If you also look at what Jesus says in John 14:16-26: ""And I will pray the Father, and He will give you another Helper, that He may abide with you forever--"
""the Spirit of truth, whom the world cannot receive, because it neither sees Him nor knows Him; but you know Him, for He dwells with you and will be in you. "I will not leave you orphans; I will come to you. "At that day you will know that I am in My Father, and you in Me, and I in you."
""He who has My commandments and keeps them, it is he who loves Me. And he who loves Me will be loved by My Father, and I will love him and manifest Myself to him. "Judas (not Iscariot) said to Him, "Lord, how is it that You will manifest Yourself to us, and not to the world?" Jesus answered and said to him, "If anyone loves Me, he will keep My word; and My Father will love him, and We will come to him and make Our home with him. "He who does not love Me does not keep My words; and the word which you hear is not Mine but the Father's who sent Me. "These things I have spoken to you while being present with you. "But the Helper, the Holy Spirit, whom the Father will send in My name, He will teach you all things, and bring to your remembrance all things that I said to you."
OK, so here Jesus says several different things. He says that He will send the Holy Spirit to those who believe. He says that He and the Father will come and make their home with those who love Jesus and keep His word. So, as you can see, Jesus Himself equates the Father, Himself and the Holy Spirit as One. They each are the same God. Not 3 Gods, but One. Three persons, One God. God is not a human being, He is the unlimited God, without beginning and without end. He existed before creation because He is the Creator. He is the self-existent One. He has no need and He is who He is. It is not up to us to understand Him, it is ours to come to Him as we are, as little children who simply trust in and rely up Him, our Father.
KHALILUR RAHMAN
Thanks for your reply. In reply to your views, I have the following points: As per Deuteronomy, a hanged man will have following specialty : 1. He commits sin. 2. That committed sin deserves death punishment. 3. He is put to death by hanging on a tree. 4. His body shall not remain overnight on the tree. 5. This hanged man is accursed of God. Now Jesus was put to death on cross. Do you think he had all these specialties who deserves death punishment? Did he commit sin? Did his sin deserve death punishment? Was he a cursed person? I do not know what will be your reply. But Church tried to reply this question by putting everybody's sins on the shoulder of Jesus. They say, Jesus died to pay for our sins. It does not sound logical at all. At this stage, I should mention what Qur'an says about this. Qur'an says- "He ( Jesus) was not killed, not crucified, it was made appear like this. Rather, He was taken up towards Allah".
"In your seed all the nations of the earth shall be blessed, because you have obeyed My voice."" Gen 22:18 . This seed is certainly not Jesus. Because Jesus did not come for whole world. He, very categorically said that he is only for the lost sheep of Israel. He ordered his disciple not to go the Gentiles. (Mathew 10:5-7 )- Do not go to Non-Jews and the village of Samaria . Only go to the lost sheep of Israel. (Mathew 15:24)- “Jesus said-I am sent only to the lost sheep of Israel”. (Mathew 15:26) -It is not good to give the food of Children to dogs. Jesus treated Gentiles as dogs. What you quoted from Galatians is written by Paul to counter those people who wanted to follow the Laws of Moses. Please read the preface of Galatians & you will find out all these facts. Whole book of Galatians is the opinions of Paul. Now question arises who is that seed of Abraham who will bless the whole world. That seed is the Prophet of Islam who is the direct descendent of Abraham through his first son Ishmael. God declared him in Qur'an as the blessings of whole universe. The Helper/Comforter/Advocate/Counselor who is supposed to come after Jesus is surely not Holy Spirit. Holy spirit was present even before the birth of Jesus. Prophet John was filled with Holy Spirit even when he was in the womb of his mother ( Luke 1:15). Holy Spirit came to Mary also ( Luke 1:35). Jesus was also filled with Holy Spirit. Jesus says in John 14:16-26: ""And I will pray the Father, and He will give you another Helper, that He may abide with you forever". Why Jesus will pray for a thing which is already available. So, Helper is certainly not Holy Spirit. All the prophets of God are the Spirit of Truth, they are the way & life for their people during that period. Abraham was the way & life for his people, Moses was the way & life for Israelis during his time. It is not special for Jesus only. It is true for all Prophets. Now I ask you one question. What exactly you mean by begotten son & why you call Jesus the begotten son of God.
At 11:23 AM 5/22/2012,
connect@godlife.com wrote:
Dear Khalilur,
Thank you for your recent emails. I will get to them as soon as I can, but before I go any further,
I must say that I notice that you have not answered any of my personal questions to you.
So, let's lay aside the doctrinal discussion for a real, personal one:
1: Do you know God? I mean do you really KNOW God. Do you hear His voice and know that you are a child of God?
2: Have you been born again?
3: Are you going to heaven?
4: How can your sins be forgiven?
5: Does God overlook sin or must it be paid for?
Thank you for your recent emails. I will get to them as soon as I can, but before I go any further,
I must say that I notice that you have not answered any of my personal questions to you.
So, let's lay aside the doctrinal discussion for a real, personal one:
1: Do you know God? I mean do you really KNOW God. Do you hear His voice and know that you are a child of God?
2: Have you been born again?
3: Are you going to heaven?
4: How can your sins be forgiven?
5: Does God overlook sin or must it be paid for?
KHALILUR RAHMAN
Thanks for your mail. Now I will reply to all personal questions you asked one by one as per serial.
1. Yes, I really know who is God. " He is Allah the One and Only , Allah the Eternal Absolute , He neither beget nor is He begotten , and there is none like unto Him".. this is a chapter from the Holy Qur'an which tells us that God is beyond your imagination and none like Him.
If you talk about real sound
from God, only Moses used to talk to God directly, but that also from behind
the cloud. It was a special favour given to Moses. However, Moses also did not
see God. For other Prophets, Arc Gabriel & other angels used to communicate
with them on behalf of God. For others, it is not possible to talk to God in
this life. But we will see & talk to God in our life hereafter if we go to
heaven.
In old & New Testament, anybody who believes in God & follows his commandments is called the son of God. In Islam, this term is replaced by Servant. All the creature of God including mankind is his servant.
In old & New Testament, anybody who believes in God & follows his commandments is called the son of God. In Islam, this term is replaced by Servant. All the creature of God including mankind is his servant.
2. Qur'an says- " All
the living creature will get the taste of death." Jesus did not die. He
was taken up alive. He will come back & have the taste of death after his
mission. I am still alive, so question of born again does not arise. On doom's
day ( Kiamat) all will die. But, we will be raised up again on the Day of Judgment.
You may call that reborn.
3. Insha-Allah, I will go to
heaven.
4. When I realize that I
have committed a sin, straightway I must face God & ask for his forgiveness
& promise to Him not to commit that sin again. Insha-Allah, God will
forgive me. But, if my sin causes harm to anybody, I must ask forgiveness from
that man also, sometimes you may have to compensate or pay penalty to him. It
depends case to case.
5. Qur'an says- " Then anyone who has done an atom's weight of good, shall see it.. And anyone who has done an atom's weight of evil, shall see it". So, nothing will be lost. Everything, good or evil, will be written in that book. Your evils & good will be compared & weighed. If your good has more weight than weight of evil, you will go to heaven, otherwise to hell.
That was the answer in short. But each point needs more detail explanation to understand properly.
At 10:39 AM 5/24/2012, connect@godlife.com
wrote:5. Qur'an says- " Then anyone who has done an atom's weight of good, shall see it.. And anyone who has done an atom's weight of evil, shall see it". So, nothing will be lost. Everything, good or evil, will be written in that book. Your evils & good will be compared & weighed. If your good has more weight than weight of evil, you will go to heaven, otherwise to hell.
That was the answer in short. But each point needs more detail explanation to understand properly.
Thank you for honestly answering these questions. Jesus said; the truth will set you free; and I believe that didn't just mean eternal truth, but also, being honest with Him and one another.
Here are my responses to what you wrote:
You wrote: 1. Yes, I really know who is God.
My reply: I didn't ask if you knew who God is, but do you know Him, as a man knows his father? This is the promise that Jesus made and I can tell you that it is true, for now I truly know God. I once did not know Him. I know the difference between not knowing Him and now knowing Him. In John 17:3 Jesus defined eternal life. He said "And this is eternal life, to KNOW THEE, the Only True God and Jesus Christ whom you have sent".
Eternal life is to know God, personally. So those who do not have the Spirit of Christ, are not children of God. They are still dead in their trespasses and sins, as I once was. Blind to knowing God, for I was separated from Him by my sins. But Isha (Jesus) took the penalty for my sins (death) and rose again from the dead so I could have ETERNAL life (which is to know God).
You wrote:
2. Quran says- "All the living creature will get the taste ofdeath" Jesus did not die. He was taken up alive.
My reply: The Bible clearly teaches that Jesus physically died on the Cross and then rose from the dead. I know you don't believe the Bible, but once you know God, you will know the Bible is true.
There is no religion that brings people to God.
Neither Islam, Buddism, Christianity, Judiasm, you name it, none of them make a way for people actually be able to reach God.
ONLY God can reach to where man is, and He did this by becoming a man and dwelling among us.
This is who Jesus is, was and is to yet come again.
You wrote:
3. Insha-Allah, I will go to heaven.
My reply: I am already in heaven. That is, because Jesus has washed me from all of my sins, and has given me His Holy Spirit, He has made me a child of God and now I am under the rulership of God, so I am in the Kingdom of Heaven, for I am under the rulership of the God of heaven. When I leave this body, I will see Him face to face, but until then, I am seated with Christ in the Heavenly places, that is, I live under His authority and I speak from His authority and represent Him, as His ambassador to a lost and dead world, that they might be saved.
You wrote:
4. When I realize that I have committed a sin, straightway I must
face God and ask for his forgiveness promise to Him not to commit
that sin again. Insha-Allah, God will forgive me.
My reply:
In 1 John 1:9 the Bible says: "if we confess our sins He is faithful AND JUST to forgive us".
HOW, how is God JUST in forgiving us? Didn't we sin? Don't we deserve to die? Does God change His mind and say 'oh, it's OK, I will overlook your sin?' NO, that would be impossible! God CANNOT change, for He is perfect, Holy and just.
So, how why can He forgive sins? BECAUSE THEY HAVE BEEN PAID FOR ALREADY.
In the old testament it is written "without the shedding of blood there is no remission of sins".
So, it's not that God forgives sin, per se, no, He is justified in forgiving us because He paid the price for our sins, so His righteous law was fulfilled and His righteous, Holy character did not change.
You also said that if your good outweighs your bad, you will go to heaven. I have to tell you, the truth is, this is simply impossible. ONE sin is enough to keep you out of heaven, for God is PERFECT and He cannot change. He CANNOT overlook sin, for that would be un loving, un just and contrary to the very nature of the Only True and Holy God.
So, my friend, it is my main purpose in life to lead people to the saving knowledge of God: The Good News (Gospel), that God so loved the world that He sent His ONLY BEGOTTEN Son.
God is NOT begotten, but He definitely CAN beget! Nothing is impossible for God, except for Him to stop being who He is! (God, which is why He cannot lie.)
Jesus said 'in order to see the kingdom of God you MUST be born again'. I have been born again, for TODAY (the bible says) is the day of salvation.
The day of judgment is NOT the day of salvation. It is the day of judgment. On that day, all men WILL be judged by their works, just as you said, however, NO ONE WILL BE SAVED by those works. No, instead, each work will be viewed and be seen to be woefully inadequate to meet the righteous standard of God, which is PERFECTION.
Only God is perfect and only He can make us perfect and He does that as we humble ourselves before Him, TODAY, and accept His free gift of eternal life given through His Son Jesus.
KHALILUR RAHMAN
Before I give comments on your reply, I must clarify some points from you.. I want your honest reply. Mostly you are referring to the letters written by Paul for the people of different cities. Most of these letters were written long after the departure of Jesus, may be after more than 20 years. These letters are included in Bible. Paul was not a disciple of Jesus. He never met Jesus during his life time. Paul was a staunchest enemy of Jesus & his followers. He took a leading part to condemn Jesus & to put him to cross. Several years after the departure of Jesus, suddenly Paul declared himself as the believer of Jesus & started preaching the teachings of Jesus. But his teachings were not same as taught by Jesus, mostly they are opposite in nature. Jesus ordered his disciple not to preach to Non-Jew. Paul was preaching to Non-Jews Pagans. Jesus told to follow the commandments & Laws of Moses. Paul said, it is not required, only believing in Jesus is sufficient for salvation. Jesus was circumcised & it was must for his followers. Paul said, it is not required. Jesus prayed to One God. Paul raised Jesus to the level of God & introduced Trinity. He took cross as the symbol of his religion. He preached that Jesus has paid for the sin of others by giving life on cross. Jesus asked his Disciple to wait for the Helper/Comforter to come. Paul explained, Holy Ghost is the Helper & he made Holy Ghost another God.
Paul's preaching was not agreed by the real disciples of Jesus. After seventeen years of his preaching, Paul came to Jerusalem to meet the real disciples of Jesus to get their approval of his preaching. He could meet only Peter, Jacob, John and Barnabus who were the real disciples of Jesus. He met them secretly & did not dare to meet others. But, finally these disciples did not agree to Paul. Paul went back & started writing letters to different cities in favour of his new concepts. Please read Galatians & you will find a clear picture what happened.
Now you may ask a question, why majority of the people accepted the concept of Paul. Answer is very simple. Paul preached his concept among the European non-Jew people who were Pagans.. They did not have any concept of One God like Jews. Moreover, it was a very easy religion. Only believe & you are saved. No extra work, no daily prayer, no fasting, no sacrifice, no charity giving, even you can commit any sin because Jesus has already paid for your sin. No restrictions on food & drink. I don't want to talk about sex life.
Now my question to you is: Do you follow Jesus & his disciples or do you follow Paul? If you follow Jesus, I call you Christian. If you follow Paulism, you are not a Christian, may be called Paulinist. Please reply honestly, because I plan our future discussion on your reply.
At 10:35 AM 5/25/2012, you wrote:
Dear Khalilur,
First, you are not answering my questions, but going off on other issues. I will address your questions here, but I await your other answers........
It's curious that you assert that the Pauline letters are basically heresy, but you base your arguments on other parts of the New Testament, while you are one who rejects the teachings of Bible itself, so you use parts of the Bible, which you reject to tell me that I should reject even other parts of it! Interesting strategy.
If you purpose is to undermine my faith, then I understand, if it is to truly seek truth as you said, then I do not understand why you do what you do.
Ok: you wrote: Paul was the staunchest enemy of Jesus and his disciples.
I ask: How do you know that? On what do you base this assertion? How did you learn this?
You said: Paul's teaching was mostly the opposite of what Jesus taught.
I ask: How do you know that? On what do you base this assertion? How did you learn this?
You said: Paul's teaching was not agreed with by most of Jesus' disciples.
I ask: Again, how do you know this? Where do you get your information.
Also, this is a simply ridiculous assertion. I actually study the Bible and I know what the various gospels teach, what the letters of Peter say, what the letters of John say as well as what the old testament says.
Paul's teachings did not disagree with those of the other disciples, but I don't know how to prove that to you without going line by line
You said:
"Jesus told to follow the commandments & Laws of Moses"
Again, where did you get this information? The Bible? My answer: In John 10 Jesus makes it clear that He has sheep that are not of the fold of the Jews, so Gentiles were also going to be saved: (Also notice here how the Jews thought Jesus was saying that He was equal with God)..... As for the Way of salvation, NOT being by keeping the Law: John 3:1-5 This is Jesus speaking to Nicodemus: "There was a man of the Pharisees named Nicodemus, a ruler of the Jews. This man came to Jesus by night and said to Him, "Rabbi, we know that You are a teacher come from God; for no one can do these signs that You do unless God is with him." Jesus answered and said to him, "Most assuredly, I say to you, unless one is born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God." Nicodemus said to Him, "How can a man be born when he is old? Can he enter a second time into his mother's womb and be born?" Jesus answered, "Most assuredly, I say to you, unless one is born of water and the Spirit, he cannot enter the kingdom of God." NOTICE, no mention of Moses, no mention of the Commandments in order to enter the kingdom of God. Jesus instead said that YOU must be born again. OK, now HERE, Jesus speaks of Moses. What does He say? John 3: 14-17 "And as Moses lifted up the serpent in the wilderness, even so must the Son of Man be lifted up, that whoever believes in Him should not perish but have eternal life Jesus tells how He must be lifted up on a stake/tree/cross just like the bronze serpent was held up my Moses so the people could be healed from the consequence of their sin. Jesus was nailed to that cross by God the Father to pay the penalty for all sins, that we might be delivered from death and born again. So, in closing: you asked me who I follow....Jesus and His disciples or Paul? I am a person who has been born again of the Spirit of God. I am a child of the Living God. The God of Abarham, Issac and Jacob. The Great I AM, Jesus Christ, the same yesterday today and forever. I follow Him, for He is my life. I follow the example of all of the disciples of Christ, including Paul and many who are alive today, for we are One body, all born of Him and nourished by the Spirit who lives within us. All who teach otherwise are robbers and thieves (these are the words of Jesus, by the way)."All who ever came before Me are thieves and robbers, but the sheep did not hear them." John 10:8 KHALILUR RAHMAN
I am sorry if I hurt your feelings. I
never intend to undermine your faith. However, I myself is totally confused
to find out which one is to be followed from Bible. Each part is
contradicting with another part, one sentence is contradicting another
sentence, and even the statements are so ambiguous that hardly anybody
understands it. I will come that point later on. Firstly, let me reply your
questions.
You asked me how I know that Paul was the staunchest enemy of Jesus. Paul himself confessed it. He said- " I am sure that you have heard the story of my earlier life when I lived in the Jewish way. In those days I went all out in persecuting God's church. I was systematically destroying it" (Galatians 1: 14-15). You asked me how I know that Paul's teaching was mostly the opposite of what Jesus taught. There are many & mostly. I will give you only some examples. Please read the following verses from Mathew. Mathew 10:5-7 “Do not go to Non-Jew and the village of Samaria . Only go to the lost sheep of Israel”. Mathew 15:24 Jesus said-“I am sent only to the lost sheep of Israel”. Mathew 15:26 “It is not good to give the food of Children to dogs.” Paul was the first person to violate this order of Jesus. He was preaching among the Pagans of Rome & other European cities. But he did not disclose this to the original disciples of Jesus. After 14 years, he took Barnabus with him & went to Jerusalem to get approval of his concept because he was not sure whether he is correct or not. Please read again the verses below. Galatians 2:1-3 " After 14 years Barnabus& I went to Jerusalem & took Titus with us. I went to clarify with them what had been revealed to me. I told them what I was preaching with non-Jews. I told them in private because I was afraid what I am doing & what I have done may be in vain. Although a non-Jew, my companion Titus was not compelled to circumcise." Jesus was circumcised at the age of 8 days & it was compulsory for all others. Luke 2:21- "When eighth day arrived, the day of circumcision, the child was named Jesus, the name given by Angels before he was conceived." Now what happened in Jerusalem? Barnabus& Paul was received in Jerusalem by the leaders & apostles. They sat on a conference to discuss about the proposals of Paul. Some Pharisees were in the opinion of Circumcision & Law of Moses. " You have to circumcise the Pagan converts & you must make them to keep the Laws of Moses" ( Act 15:5). Now please see below what Jesus said about the Laws & Commandments. Mathew 5:17-20 “Do not think that I come to destroy the Law and commandments of Moses, but to strengthen them.” Mathew 18:16-21 People asked-“How to get eternal life in Heaven.” Jesus said- Obey the Commandments of God.” Mathew 23:2-3 -“Do what you are told to follow the laws of Moses”. Luke 16:29 - “For salvation, give attention to the books of Moses & Prophets”. In that Conference Peter was talking in favour of Paul. Finally they decided to follow the following laws only- " Not to associate with activities connected with idols, no adultery, no flesh & blood of a triangulated animal." ( Act 15:20). Paul came back & started preaching against Law of Moses whole heartedly giving all sort of explanation ( Galatians 3:1;25) Paul said- " Now faith has come & we are no more under the burden of Laws." ( Galatians 3:25). Now my question is : Can any Disciples or any followers of Jesus do repeal or abrogate any order of Jesus ? Is there any authority for that? Your last question was, did anybody disagree with Paul? Only Peter & Barnabus was with Paul. But finally both of them left him. Paul continued his struggle alone. Paul said- “Later, when Peter came to Antioch, I had a face to face confrontation with him because he was clearly out of line. Here's the situation. Earlier, before certain persons had come from James, Peter regularly ate with non-Jews. But, when the conservative group came from Jerusalem, he cautiously pulled back & put as much as distance from non-Jews friend. That’s how fearful he was of the conservative Jews clique that’s been pushing the old system of circumcision. Unfortunately, the rest of the Jews in the Antioch Church joined in that hypocrisy so that even Barnabus was swept along in the charade." ( Galatians 2:11-1?) Now my friend, have you seen that all Jews disciples of Jesus had left Paul & now it has become a non-Jews Paulian religion which has repealed most of the orders/Instruction/teachings of Jesus. To: khalil@optimaxbd.net …….. |
||
Dear Khalilur,
Thank you for your concern that
you may have hurt my feelings. In fact, you did not. My point was that you do
not actually answer my direct questions about your own state, but rather you
wish to debate scripture, which you clearly do not believe anyway.
You are a Muslim and reject the Bible as the Word of God, yet you wish to pit one scripture against another in an effort to undermine the whole of scripture. It's a waste of time. I am much more concerned that you are going to die in your trespasses and sins, thinking that you are doing all your good deeds in the name of God and on the day of Judgment you will stand before Jesus and say "Lord, Lord, have I not done all these things in your name" and on that Day He will say to you "get from me you worker of unrighteousness, I never knew you". (Matthew 7:23). Your religion can do no good for me. I keep the Law of God as much or more than anyone you know, save the sacrifices as detailed by Moses. But my righteous acts are not done to give me good standing before God, but because I AM NOW A CHILD OF GOD. I have been born of "incorruptible seed", through the very Word of God, the Gospel. (1 Peter 1:23) The Spirit of Truth having come and made His home in me. (John 14:7) |
||
KHALILUR RAHMAN
I have received your two letters. I will now reply both of them. I am extremely grateful to you that you are so much worried for my salvation. But, my friend, I am already blessed by the seed of Abraham. Insha-Allah, I will get salvation & will go to heaven. Rather , I am worried about your salvation. You quoted from Bible- "on the day of Judgment you will stand before Jesus and say "Lord, Lord, have I not done all these things in your name" and on that Day He will say to you "get from me you worker of unrighteousness, I never knew you". (Matthew 7:23)". You did not quote the full verse. Are you afraid of quoting the whole truth? The whole verse is like this as below: " On that day, many will say to me ( Jesus )- Lord, Lord, have we not predict future on your name, have we not spell out the spirits on your name, have we not done all these miracles in your name ? Then I will tell them- "get out from me you worker of unrighteousness, I never knew you". (Matthew 7:22-23)". Now who are these people Jesus talking about? Muslim does not do anything in the name of Jesus, Hindus does not do anything in the name of Jesus, and Jews does not do anything in the name of Jesus. Only Christian people do all these things mentioned above in the name of Jesus. So, many of you will be thrown out on that day by Jesus. Did you get the truth of this verse? Even a child can understand it. That is why I am afraid about your salvation because you & your nation is totally misguided by Paul & far out of the way of Jesus. Only Faith is not sufficient to enter heaven. You need righteous deeds also. And what is righteous deed? Righteous deeds are defined & prescribed by the Law & Commandments of God. If you become the worker of unrighteousness, Jesus will tell you- “Get out of me. I never knew you." In my last letter, I talked in details about Paul & his activities. You did not tell me those are true or not. Everything about him I quoted from Bible. If they are not true, you must tell me that they are wrong & why. I showed that all the disciples of Jesus from Jerusalem including Peter &Barnabus from Antioch & other Jew origin Christians from Antioch did not agree to the concept of Paul & left him alone. I never talked anything outside Bible. My all quotations are from Bible & I quoted only those statements which are very clear & unambiguous. You have made some comments on my quotations. I reply them in my next mail.
At 02:44 AM 5/28/2012, you
wrote:
Dear Khalilur, I assume you received my other email with my replies regarding the scriptures you quoted, so I will await your reply to that. Reading what you've written, I can see that you completely disregard the teachings of Paul, as not being the Word of God. What about the Books of : Matthew, Mark, Luke, John, Acts. 1-3John, James, Revelations? Hebrews? Are these the Word of God? What about the Old Testament, are any of those the Word of God? KHALILUR RAHMAN Let me reply your this small letter first. After my breakfast, I will sit down with your big letters. If you read all the available scriptures of different religions of the world, you can easily compare & judge their status. Books of Mathew, Mark, Luke & John of New Testament are written by Mathew, Mark, Luke & John in their own language, but they contain the activities/teachings/sayings of Jesus as they have seen it. Revelation is the Visions/predictions of future seen by John & described by him in his own language. The remaining books of New Testament are mostly letters for different churches written by Paul & others. They contain mostly advices, directives, analysis, quotations etc made by the respective writers. The translation of these books in different languages has, sometimes, changed the inner meanings of it as well. Old Testament is more clear than New Testament. It is also a mixture of everything including history described by the authors But it contains many directives of God coming direct from God. Hindu Scriptures are more or less like Old Testament. But they could maintain the original scripture in Sanskrit language, although translations are also available in different languages. Qur'an is the only scripture now available in the world which is kept in its most original form as it came from God. Nobody can change even a letter from it. Translations are available in different languages. But the original text is always kept with the translation so that anybody can refer it in case of any confusion. At 09:39 AM 5/27/2012, you wrote:
Dear Khalilur,
I trust you have already received my previous response about my heart’s desire to see you saved. This response is now in response to what you say Jesus and His disciples taught, verses what Paul taught. 1: You wrote: Mathew 10: 5-7 "Do not go to Non-Jew and the village of Samaria . Only go to the lost sheep of Israel". Answer: Jesus was directing His disciples before He was crucified. He was directing them to go to the house of Israel to preach that the Kingdom of God had come (HE IS, the kingdom of God that had come, by the way). Now, same book: Look now at what Jesus said AFTER His resurrection: Matthew 28: 18-20 "And Jesus came and spoke to them, saying, "All authority has been given to Me in heaven and on earth. Go therefore and make disciples of all the nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit, teaching them to observe all things that I have commanded you; and lo, I am with you always, even to the end of the age. Amen." 2: You wrote: Mathew 15: 24 Jesus said-"I am sent only to the lost sheep of Israel". Mathew 15: 26 "It is not good to give the food of Children to dogs." Same answer as above: You MUST read things in the context they are given 3: You wrote: Mathew 5: 17-20 "Do not think that I come to destroy the Law and commandments of Moses, but to strengthen them." Answer: YES Indeed! Jesus did come to fulfill ALL that the Law and the Prophets foretold. And notice, again, IN CONTEXT, how Jesus ends this teaching....look at verse 48: "Therefore you shall be perfect, just as your Father in heaven is perfect.". PERFECT! God expects you to be PERFECT. HOW? How is this possible? By keeping the law? I don't think so! I mean, even if you could start today and then actually NEVER sin again, you STILL wouldn't be perfect, because you already sinned! How will you get rid of the sins you already did? By being sorry? Being sorry for our sin doesn't pay the price for it. The price for sin is death! You MUST die to pay for your sins, OR you can accept the sacrifice God made for your sins. He KILLED HIS OWN SON. Will you spit in His face by rejecting His love and insisting on trying to be perfect on your own? What an insult!
You wrote;-
Mathew 23: 2-3 -"Do what you are told to follow the laws of Moses". My answer: Yes, Jesus DID say this, but NOT as a means of salvation. But as a matter of fact, that we are supposed to obey God...read the ENTIRE scripture. "Woe to you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! For you cleanse the outside of the cup and dish, but inside they are full of extortion and self-indulgence." I must say, those of you who focus on 'keeping the law' are concerned with how you look, but not if God has your heart. You focus on doing things FOR God, rather than submitting to His lordship and allowing Him to actually give you a new heart. Give up! Jesus said "come to me and I will give you REST". He didn't come to tie upon us a heavy burden, but to lift the burden onto His shoulders and to lead us in Love. Luke 16: 29 - "For salvation, give attention to the books of Moses & Prophets". Answer: Well, you have completely misquoted this verse. It has NOTHING to do with what you say that Jesus was teaching. This story is Jesus teaching about an interaction between two dead people, one who was in hell and one who was in Abrahams bossom (the place people went before Jesus died for the sins of the world and rose from the dead, NOW, people go to either hell or heaven, for now, in Christ we are perfect. Before Christ, all we had was the Law and the law could NEVER make someone perfect.) But here, look at what James, the BROTHER of Jesus wrote about the law: "But he who looks into the perfect law of liberty and continues [in it], and is not a forgetful hearer but a doer of the work, this one will be blessed in what he does." He refers to something called "the LAW of LIBERTY". What do you suppose that Law is? I will tell you what is it: It is the Law of Love. God so LOVED the world that He gave. You see, it's not about what we must do for God, it's about what God already did for us. KHALILUR RAHMAN
Now I will try to reply your this
letter, Insha-Allah.
You said, Jesus directed his disciple not to go to Non-Jews before his crucifixion. But after he is crucified, he ordered them to go to all the people. These two statements are contradictory to each other. My question is , which one is more credible, statement given by Jesus in public when he was alive or statement given by his spirit on top of a hillock in front of his 11 disciples? I believe, a living Jesus is more reliable & credible. Please read the last instructions of Jesus from other 3 books also. Please read John 21:15-19. You will find that Jesus gave last instruction to Peter to look after his lambs of Israel. He did not tell him to go to others. Jesus also predicted that Peter will join somebody unwillingly at his old days. This man may be Paul. You have to derive the truth from all these. To reply your second question, I must say that the two verses I quoted from Bible are so clear &unambiguous that everybody will understand it. You cannot explain it to get other meanings. If Jesus says, he is for the lambs of Israel, certainly he is. Jesus cannot lie. I can tell you same thing to reply your 3rd question. if Jesus says, you have to keep the Laws & Commandments, then that is the way to attain perfection. To reply your 4th question, I also say that yes, Jesus told us to clean the cup from inside & outside. Your faith will clean inside & keeping Laws & Commandments will clean your outside. Jesus emphasized both Faith & Laws. For your 5th question, yes, it is a story of two dead men. But who is describing this story as example? While Jesus telling this story, he narrated the statement of Abraham. Abraham said, give attention to the books of Moses & Prophets for salvation. Now I have one question to you. Jesus called himself Son of Man & Son of God. His 12 disciples are also called Son of God. Even Jesus said- - Who so ever have faith on Jesus, he is the son of God (John 1:12). So, you are also son of God. But, sometimes you call Jesus the Begotten Son of God. What you mean by begotten, what is its dictionary meaning & why Jesus should be the begotten son. You must quote from Bible in your reply.
.At 04:38 AM 5/28/2012,
connect@godlife.com wrote:
Dear Khalilur,
Since I am fasting and praying today, I thought I'd take the time to respond to what you wrote in previous emails that I hadn't yet specifically replied to. You wrote: Now I will reply to the last portion of yourreply. You said in Colossians 1: 17-20: it isclearly saying that Jesus is the Creator, who isGod and that the Father is also God. This is theclaim by the people who wrote Collosians afterJesus. Jesus never said that he is the creator.It is no where in Old Testament also that Jesus is the Creator. My reply: In John 8:58& 59 Jesus said: "Jesus said to them, "Most assuredly, I say to you, before Abraham was, I AM." Then they took up stones to throw at Him; but Jesus hid Himself and went out of the temple, going through the midst of them, and so passed by." Why did the Religious people pick up stones to throw at Jesus here? It was because He claimed divinity. He said 'before Abraham was, I AM'. All Jews know that ONLY God is I AM. Only God could have been 'before Abraham was'. There is no question that Jesus equated Himself with God. It is the reason the Jews ultimately killed Him....John 5:18 : "Therefore the Jews sought all the more to kill Him, because He not only broke the Sabbath, but also said that God was His Father, making Himself equal with God." I think you would agree that ONLY God is the Creator. Therefore, JESUS DID CLAIM TO BE THE CREATOR. OK, now for part 2 to your question: The Old Testament. You say there is no where in the Old Testament that Jesus is the Creator. Let's look. Isaiah 44: 6,7,8 and 24 say: ""Thus says the LORD, the King of Israel, And his Redeemer, the LORD of hosts: 'I am the First and I am the Last; Besides Me there is no God." And who can proclaim as I do? Then let him declare it and set it in order for Me, Since I appointed the ancient people. And the things that are coming and shall come, Let them show these to them. Do not fear, nor be afraid; Have I not told you from that time, and declared it? You are My witnesses. Is there a God besides Me? Indeed there is no other Rock; I know not one.' " 24: Thus says the LORD, your Redeemer, And He who formed you from the womb: "I am the LORD, who makes all things, Who stretches out the heavens all alone, Who spreads abroad the earth by Myself;" OK, obviously, this scripture is talking about God, the Creator. However, it is also obvious that is speaks of Jesus. Where? Look at the first verse: "Thus says the LORD......and His redeemer, the LORD of hosts. The word LORD in the Bible is the great I AM, or YHWH (Jehovah in English Bibles). So, this reads, Thus says Jehovah and His redeemer, Jehovah of hosts..... I AM THE FIRST AND THE LAST, BESIDES ME THERE IS NO GOD. OK, again, obviously this is GOD. Okay, now for your second question: You said Jesus called Himself the Son of man, not the Son of God and that He was sent FROM God, (so you are implying that He couldn't be God if He was sent from God). My answer: Why not? Why can't Jesus say that God sent Him and He still be the very God who sent Him? The Lord talks about Himself this way throughout the Old Testament. I, being an actually child of the living God, knows this for I read His word every day. You, who choose not to follow Jehovah, but Allah, can only search the scriptures hoping to find something to disprove the Bible itself. I cannot help you if you do not want help. I am sorry to be so blunt, but you make it clear that you do not believe in the God of Abaraham, father of the Jews, but believe that Abraham is the father of your faith, Islam and that Mohammed is the Prophet that Jesus said would come. So, you aren't asking questions to learn, but to instruct and you cannot do so, because you do not know God. If you wish to convert me to Islam, then show me in the Qur’an that your God is the true and living God. You will never be able to convince me by the Bible. I know it far better than you, for I know the Author personally. You see, I will not be saved on the day of judgment. The reason for this, is because I have ALREADY passed from death to life. My judgment is passed. Jesus took upon Himself the penalty for my sins. Does this give me license to sin? Of course not! Anyone who is born of God cannot continue in the same habitual sins that had before, because they are now a new creation! They are born again. Born of God. God does not sin, so His children will not practice sin! They may fall on occasion, for they are not yet in Heaven, in their glorified state, but they are, never the less, His children and they are being transformed from glory to glory into the image of the Son, Jesus Christ. Ok, on to your next question: You wrote: I think Christians also did not understand this phrase.Jesus already clarified it in John 6: 35-36. Whoso ever believe in Jesus, he gets that bread oflife & does not have thirst &hunger. He will belifted alive on Final Day ( John 6: 40).. So,eating of flesh & blood means accepting Jesus in totality & follow his teachings. My answer: Not bad! I almost agree with you. Yes, eating His flesh and drinking His blood is obviously not literal. It speaks of accepting His death on the cross as that which gives you new life. And, as He said at the last supper, Take, eat, this is my body....take eat, this is my blood. So, it's our acceptance of His sacrifice that gives us new life. By belieiving, we are taking of His body and His blood and we are born again, having received the Holy Spirit of God, we now are new creatures in Christ and we begin to naturally do the things of God, for we are now His children.
KHALILUR RAHMAN
You said you are fasting today. Can you please tell me how is the way of your fasting . I will tell you about our fasting. Every year, we have compulsory fasting of 1 month continuous. Every Muslim has to fast during this month. Our fasting starts from 2 hours before sunrise & ends at sunset. During fasting, we do not eat or drink at all. Even a drop of water is not allowed. No sex at all even with wife & try to avoid all types of sin. This month we do maximum charity. Minimum is 2.5% of our savings. And we have special charity on Eid day. This is in short about fasting. You have quoted John 8:58-59 to prove that Jesus is equal to God & so he is also the creator of this universe. You please read the whole chapter & you will find that no where Jesus said that he is God. Rather the whole chapter is confusing & ambiguous. No clear-cut answer is there. "Pharisees asked him- Where is your Father? ( John 8:19)" . Jesus did not give any clear reply. He replied- “You do not know me, so you do not know my father...." He should have clearly told them- My Father is in the heaven or something like that. You also read John 8:25. They asked Jesus- Who are you? Again Jesus did not reply clearly. He should have replied, I am God or I am Christ or I am son of God or I am a Messenger of God or something clear-cut like that. But he said- " I am that whatever I am telling from the beginning. There are many things to judge me. Who has sent me, there is no untruth in Him. I tell you only those things which I hear from Him." What was the question & what is the reply. It made people more confused. Now see again- "Then the Jews surrounded Him and said to Him, "How long do You keep us in doubt? If You are the Christ, tell us plainly." Here please note that the Jews are begging to him to reply in clear language whether he is Christ or not. But Jesus did not give any clear reply. Jesus answered them, "I told you, and you do not believe. The works that I do in My Father's name, they bear witness of Me." Have you seen that there is no clear-cut answer for anything. People got more confused .This type of examples are many & many in New Testament. Old Testament is much more clear in their statement. I do not know what is the reason for it. May be the writers of New Testament could not understand Jesus properly & could not clarify what Jesus said. May be the original script has been modified, edited, interpolated & changed to such an extent that it has lost its clarity. Or Jesus himself did not want to expose his identity fully because his actual mission yet to start. His real mission will start from the day he comes back again. Please read the following verses: John 6:14-15 Seeing the miracles of Jesus people said- " He is truly that Prophet who is supposed to come to this world". Jesus realized that the people are coming to catch him to make their king forcefully. So, he slipped off & went back to mountain alone himself. People wanted to make him king. It was not their fault because it was predicted like that in their scripture. But Jesus knew that time has not come yet. It will come true during his 2nd coming. So he was avoiding the crowd & did not disclose his identity fully as Christ. Paul & others took this opportunity of confusion & tried to equate many things to prove that Jesus is God. But a man with common sense will not accept your equation. It is a very bad mathematics. Yes, I agree that ONLY GOD IS A CREATOR. Jesus is NOT a creator because he is NOT a God. Whatever you have quoted from Old Testament, those are all about One Supreme God. BESIDES HIM THERE IS NO GOD. So, Adam is not God, Abraham is not God, Moses is not God, Jesus is not God, Mohammad is not God. There is no god except Him. This is the concept of Old Testament. They are all about One Real God. They are not about Jesus. You are quoting from Revelation. But remember, it is the Vision seen by John in his subconscious mind. Some of it may be true, some may not be true. The explanation of this vision also may differ person to person. This type of prediction is made by Nostradamus, by Jane Dickson & many others. I do not know why this type of visions are included in Bible? However, I also want to discuss about Revelation at a later date. I did not give any quotations from Qur’an, because you do not know Qur'an. I wanted to show you from your own scripture that how misguided you are. You said a real Christian also do righteous deeds. But what is your standard of right & wrong? For example, if you kiss a girl on the street of Europe, it is not an offence. But if you do the same thing in India, you commit an offence & you will be punished for public nuisance. So you need a standard. Laws & Commandments give that standard.
At 01:19 AM 5/29/2012, you wrote:
Dear Khalilur,
So, you are saying that the BagvatGhita is also the word of God? Interesting. You seem to believe that at least parts of the Old Testament are the Word of God and you seem to think maybe even some of the New Testament are the Word of God? Again, interesting.And, obviously, you believe the entire Qur'an is the Word of God. Is your entire basis for believing that the Qur'an being the Word of God is that you have the originals? Think about this, just because someone has an original document, doesn't make it the truth! I have never read the Qur'an, so you have me at a disadvantage. I apologize if I have insulted you by my words about your Holy Book. I find no reason to read that Book, for I already know God! I have read little bits and pieces and frankly, it looks like someone tried to copy sections of the Old Testament and rewrite them, and did a poor job at it, in parts of your book. But, in the words of Jesus 'greater love has no man than he lay down his life for his friends'. I am willing that you not like my words, so that you might be saved from the darkness that is in this world and the one to come. But I have a question for you, based on your beliefs do you know God personally? Has His Spirit come and made His home in you? Do you hear the voice of Jesus in your heart? These things have been promised to those who trust in, rely upon and cling to Jesus Christ as their savior and Lord. What promises do you have like this in the Qur'an? KHALILUR RAHMAN God has created this universe & He has blessings for all creatures. All the people of this world are enjoying the benefits which God had bestowed on us. A man from Japan is enjoying the similar sun shine which a man from USA is getting. Similarly God has guided all the people of the world by sending his Messengers time to time.. Qur'an says- I have sent my messengers to all the nations/tribes/races of the world to show my path of light. Do not think that God will send his man only to lamb of Israel & the remaining millions of people will remain in dark. This is not justice. God cannot do any unjust to any nation. So, the people of Japan, China, India, Mongoloid & all others received the Messengers of God & his books. Problem is that these books have been corrupted with the passage of time. God has sent new Messengers & books to correct these people again. Qur'an is the last book from God sent for the whole mankind. You will find many things in it similar to Old Testament because it is the continuation of the religion of Abraham. It is the same God of Abraham, Jacob, Moses & Jesus. Every religion, basically, has two parts : 1. Faith, 2. Righteous deeds. Both the parts are required for a complete religion. Only faith or only righteous deeds are not good enough for a total salvation. Just for your knowledge, I want to tell you what we mean by faith in Islam. Faith in Islam means having a total faith on : 1. One God Almighty, 2. His Angels, 3. All his Messengers, 4. All his books 5. Day of Judgment. Righteous deeds of Islam are defined & prescribed by our Shariah( Laws& Commandments ). Qur'an & Hadith (Tradition of Prophet) is the light of God for whole mankind & it will remain with us till the day of judgment.. As long as people will cling to it, there is no fear of going to astray. When I read Qur'an, God talks to me, I hear Him & I reply also. And when I obey Him, I get His pleasure & love. When I need anything, I pray to Him & ask from Him. In fact for everything I rely on Him. That is my total submission to Him. Muslim means who makes a total submission to God. My God promises the heaven for me & His satisfaction on me in this world & hereafter. This is the ultimate success for a man. There is a Muslim saint in Dhaka. He gives only 21 days training & then you can hear, see & talk to God. Your hearing the voice of Jesus or seeing the God or talking to Holy spirit, these are all similar type of activities which does not have any bearing on religion. It may be very exciting, but mostly these are inspired by Devil. When we discuss about Holy Spirit, we will talk more about it. At 01:03 AM 5/29/2012, connect@godlife.com wrote: Dear Khalilur, Jesus is the Christ. That is, He is the anointed One of God. He is the One God chose to send to save the world. He is the redeemer, He is Jehovah of Hosts. You asked me to reply from the Bible. Everything I just wrote is from the Bible. But to be more specific for you, I will now show you how Jesus is Begotten of God. First, here are a bunch of scriptures that refer to Jesus as the Only begotten son of God, from both the Old Testament (Psalms) and the New...... ""I will declare the decree: The LORD has said to Me, 'You are My Son, Today I have begotten You." - (Psa 2:7 NKJV) "And the Word became flesh and dwelt among us, and we beheld His glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father, full of grace and truth." - (Jhn 1:14 NKJV) "No one has seen God at any time. The only begotten Son, who is in the bosom of the Father, He has declared Him." - (Jhn 1:18 NKJV) "In this the love of God was manifested toward us, that God has sent His only begotten Son into the world, that we might live through Him." - (1Jo 4:9 NKJV) Lord appeared to him in a dream, saying, "Joseph, son of David, do not be afraid to take to you Mary your wife, for that which is conceived in her is of the Holy Spirit. And she will bring forth a Son, and you shall call His name JESUS, for He will save His people from their sins."" So all this was done that it might be fulfilled which was spoken by the Lord through the prophet, saying: "Behold, the virgin shall be with child, and bear a Son, and they shall call His name Immanuel," which is translated, "God with us."" - (Mat 1:18-23 NKJV) So, you see that Mary was inseminated by God. I don't know exactly how He did it, but He came to Here as the Holy Spirit and she was impregnated by Him, so that her egg was impregnated with God's seed. Do you know why this was necessary? Because the seed of all man is sinful, but the seed of God is pure and holy. If Jesus was the son of Joseph, His death on the cross could never have paid for our sins, for He would have had to die for His own sin. Jesus was born of the woman, in the LIKENESS of sinful flesh, but WITHOUT sin. Mary was a human being, therefore, sinful. Jesus was born of God, who is sinless. He was fully God AND fully human (man). Romans 8:3 : For what the law could not do in that it was weak through the flesh, God [did] by sending His own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh, on account of sin: He condemned sin in the flesh. So, this is your answer to how God begot Jesus.
KHALILUR RAHMAN
I am afraid of replying your this letter. In this
letter you have uttered some sentences which are so sinful, you have made
some allegations against God which are so heinous & sinful, I am afraid
to discuss them. Oh God, please forgive me if I utter these sinful words. You
claimed that Mary was inseminated by God & Jesus is the seed of God. All
quotations you have given abovedoes not say that. Holy Spirit came to Mary
& informed about a son. Then she was pregnant by the Power of God. God
does not need to put his seed to make somebody pregnant. He says- "
Be" & it is there. How Adam was created? He did not have mother
& father. Do you think he is having the seed of God.Astagfirullah. May
God forgive us for this uttering. Do you know, the present science does not
need any sperm or egg to make a man? They will take a tissue from you &
can make a complete man out of it. A man can do it, then what about God? He
is all powerful & most scientific. Do not give this heinous allegation to
God. It will make Jesus ashamed in front of God. God says in Qur'an- He is
above all these allegations they are making. He also declared His Glory &
Power in Qur'an-" If I want to destroy Jesus & his mother, can
anybody stop it ?" God addressed the Christians in Qur'an & says -
" Oh the people of Books, do not say Trinity." In other place He
says-"Certainly they do blasphemy who say God is Christ, the son of
Mary. But Christ said- Oh Children of Israel, Worship God who is my Lord
& your Lord".
Jesus does not have seed of God, but certainly he has seed of Abraham as you claimed before. He has seed of David also as described here-""He will be great, and will be called the Son of the Highest; and the Lord God will give Him the throne of His father David." - (Luke 1:32 NKJV). Here it is said that David is the father of Jesus. But it is very certain that Jesus carried the seed of Mary, because every child get 50% DNA from his father & 50% DNA from his mother. This is science & proved. So, Jesus got his seed from Mary, then from David & from Abraham also. If you say, all seeds of man is sinful, then Jesus was also having sinful seeds from his ancestors. You cannot call him innocent. At 10:34 AM 5/30/2012, connect@godlife.com wrote:
Dear Khalilur,
Thank you for sharing your beliefs with me. I believe that Islam is not from the true God, but that a messenger of Lucifer or Lucifer himself appeared to Mohammed in that cave. He was the one who choked him and told him to write. My God doesn't appear to men like that anywhere in the Bible. The closest to this is when He appeared to Jacob and He wrestled with Him and Jacob said "i will not let you go until you bless me", so the angel of the Lord touched his thigh and Jacob had to walk with a limp after that. It was after this encounter that Jacobs name was changed to Israel (governed of God). The Holy Spirit that Jesus promised in John 15, has come and made His home in me. Are you telling me that Jesus promised to send me an evil spirit? Is Jesus a prophet of God? If so, why do you say this? You obviously totally reject all of the teachings of the Bible, so on what basis doyou call Him a prophet? The Bible (new testament) was written by God through those who actually walked on earth with Jesus, yet you rely on your book, written 500 years later? Talk about bad math! |
KHALILUR RAHMAN
What you have come to know about the
incident in cave is not correct. It was not God who came to him. The correct
picture is that the Angel Arc Gabriel came to that cave & told him -
"Read". He said -" I cannot read". The Angel again told him
same thing & he replied same. Then Arc Gabriel embraced him very hard &
said- “Read, read in the name of your Lord who created mankind from a clot of
blood". Mohammad repeated this sentence after Gabriel. The angel
read 4 more verses & Mohammad repeated after the Angel. That was the start
of coming Qur'an to this earth. It took 23 years for whole Qur'an to be
revealed. I must inform you here that Mohammad could not read & write.
He was illiterate. Any verses coming from God, he memorized it on the spot
& his companions used to write it instantly.
What you believe about Islam is not correct. We do not worship Lucifer. We pray to One God Almighty, God of Abraham, Jacob, Moses, David & Jesus. We do everything in the name of God, We never do anything in the name of any man, any prophet, any Angel or any Saint.
I think there is some misunderstanding about the meaning of Prophet. In Islam the Prophet means any Messenger of God sent to this earth to guide mankind.. In that sense, Abraham, Moses, David, Jesus & many others we do not know their names but sent by God, are Prophets of God. Your definition of Prophet may be slightly different.
Certainly we believe that Jesus is a Prophet.Jesus himself said that he is sent by God & he talks only those which he hears from God. He showed many miracles to prove that he is sent by God. Old Testament predicted his coming. Qur'an also certifies his prophet hood. His name appeared in Qur'an 25 times. There is a chapter in Qur'an which is named Mary, the mother of Jesus. You did not read Qur'an. But I request you, if you have time, please read only those portion related to Jesus. Nothing wrong in it. I have read all Hindu Scriptures, Buddha Scripture &your Old & New Testament.
Jesus did not promise about Holy Spirit in John 15 & 16. It is the wrong interpretation. The original word in Latin Bible is Peraclitos or Periclitos. Different people have translated this word differently in English. Somebody says it is Comforter, some says it is Helper, some says it is Counselor, some says it is Advocate. Jesus said - I will go back to God & pray to send you this Comforter/Counselor/Helper/Advocate.. Certainly it is not Holy Spirit because Holy Spirit was present even before the birth of Jesus. It is about coming of a Prophet who will be sent for whole mankind.
What you believe about Islam is not correct. We do not worship Lucifer. We pray to One God Almighty, God of Abraham, Jacob, Moses, David & Jesus. We do everything in the name of God, We never do anything in the name of any man, any prophet, any Angel or any Saint.
I think there is some misunderstanding about the meaning of Prophet. In Islam the Prophet means any Messenger of God sent to this earth to guide mankind.. In that sense, Abraham, Moses, David, Jesus & many others we do not know their names but sent by God, are Prophets of God. Your definition of Prophet may be slightly different.
Certainly we believe that Jesus is a Prophet.Jesus himself said that he is sent by God & he talks only those which he hears from God. He showed many miracles to prove that he is sent by God. Old Testament predicted his coming. Qur'an also certifies his prophet hood. His name appeared in Qur'an 25 times. There is a chapter in Qur'an which is named Mary, the mother of Jesus. You did not read Qur'an. But I request you, if you have time, please read only those portion related to Jesus. Nothing wrong in it. I have read all Hindu Scriptures, Buddha Scripture &your Old & New Testament.
Jesus did not promise about Holy Spirit in John 15 & 16. It is the wrong interpretation. The original word in Latin Bible is Peraclitos or Periclitos. Different people have translated this word differently in English. Somebody says it is Comforter, some says it is Helper, some says it is Counselor, some says it is Advocate. Jesus said - I will go back to God & pray to send you this Comforter/Counselor/Helper/Advocate.. Certainly it is not Holy Spirit because Holy Spirit was present even before the birth of Jesus. It is about coming of a Prophet who will be sent for whole mankind.
At 08:21 AM 5/31/2012, connect@godlife.com
wrote:
Dear Khalilur,
I meant no disrespect to God. When I say that God inseminated Mary, it was accompanied by the scripture that said the Holy Spirit overshadowed her, so I was not saying they had sex. God created all things by speaking, so His Word is His power of creation.
In the beginning was the Word and the Word was with God and the Word was God. John 1:1
And the Word became flesh and dwelt among us, and we beheld His glory, as of the Only begotten of the Father, full of Grace and Truth. John 1:14
The scripture below is VERY important to you:
1Jo 2:23Whoever denies the Son does not have the Father either; he who acknowledges the Son has the Father also.
According to this Scripture, if you deny that Jesus is the Son of God, you are rejecting God the Father.
Your God is NOT the God of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob. Jesus claimed that BEFORE Abraham was, I AM. This means that since you believe the Qur’an, you do not believe in Jesus.
You believe in a different Jesus and a different God.
So, whose to say your god is better than mine? What evidence do you have that Mohammed was an actual Prophet of the True God?
My proof that Jesus is who He said He was in the Bible, is that Jesus has given me new life and not just a bunch of rules that I am supposed to keep. No, He gave me a new heart, one that is born of His incorruptible seed....His Word. He has set me free from the power of sin, and enabled me to walk pure and Holy.
I no longer walk according to the flesh and my ability to obey the law, but by the Spirit and thereby I put to death the deeds of the flesh.
Dear Khalilur,
I meant no disrespect to God. When I say that God inseminated Mary, it was accompanied by the scripture that said the Holy Spirit overshadowed her, so I was not saying they had sex. God created all things by speaking, so His Word is His power of creation.
In the beginning was the Word and the Word was with God and the Word was God. John 1:1
And the Word became flesh and dwelt among us, and we beheld His glory, as of the Only begotten of the Father, full of Grace and Truth. John 1:14
The scripture below is VERY important to you:
1Jo 2:23Whoever denies the Son does not have the Father either; he who acknowledges the Son has the Father also.
According to this Scripture, if you deny that Jesus is the Son of God, you are rejecting God the Father.
Your God is NOT the God of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob. Jesus claimed that BEFORE Abraham was, I AM. This means that since you believe the Qur’an, you do not believe in Jesus.
You believe in a different Jesus and a different God.
So, whose to say your god is better than mine? What evidence do you have that Mohammed was an actual Prophet of the True God?
My proof that Jesus is who He said He was in the Bible, is that Jesus has given me new life and not just a bunch of rules that I am supposed to keep. No, He gave me a new heart, one that is born of His incorruptible seed....His Word. He has set me free from the power of sin, and enabled me to walk pure and Holy.
I no longer walk according to the flesh and my ability to obey the law, but by the Spirit and thereby I put to death the deeds of the flesh.
KHALILUR RAHMAN
Certainly you are insulting your God
when you say Mary is inseminated by God & Jesus is carrying the seed of
God. You did not mention any thing about the quotations I have given from
Bible. Are they all wrong? Just clarify one simple matter. Do you believe that
Jesus is carrying the seed of Mary, then David & Abraham? If he carries the
seeds of these people, he is equally sinful like other people because he
carries the seeds of human.
You first clarify this point. In my next mail I will clarify why Mohammad is a Prophet of God.
You first clarify this point. In my next mail I will clarify why Mohammad is a Prophet of God.
At 12:17 PM 5/31/2012,
connect@godlife.com wrote:
Dear Khalilur,
The paraclitos, I believe you said, is the word Jesus used for the Holy Spirit. Yes, indeed, the Holy Spirit is that comforter.
Here's the actual scripture: John 16:
5 But now I go away to Him who sent Me, and none of you asks Me, Where are You going? 6 But because I have said these things to you, sorrow has filled your heart. 7 Nevertheless I tell you the truth. It is to your advantage that I go away; for if I do not go away, the Helper will not come to you; but if I depart, I will send Him to you. 12 I still have many things to say to you, but you cannot bear them now. 13 However, when He, the Spirit of truth, has come, He will guide you into all truth; for He will not speak on His own authority, but whatever He hears He will speak; and He will tell you things to come. 14 He will glorify Me, for He will take of what is Mine and declare it to you. 15 All things that the Father has are Mine. Therefore I said that He will take of Mine and declare it to you.
The word for helper here in the greek is paraclitos, or comforter. The word for the Spirit of truth is Pneuma or wind or breath. The same word always used for the Spirit of God in the new testament, such as in an earlier chapter of John:
Jhn 14:26"But the Helper, the Holy Spirit, whom the Father will send in My name, He will teach you all things, and bring to your remembrance all things that I said to you.
My friend, this is the glorious truth about Jesus! He has come to give us of His Holy Spirit! To bring us back, right now, into fellowship with Him, as pure and Holy children.
KHALILUR RAHMAN Dear Khalilur,
The paraclitos, I believe you said, is the word Jesus used for the Holy Spirit. Yes, indeed, the Holy Spirit is that comforter.
Here's the actual scripture: John 16:
5 But now I go away to Him who sent Me, and none of you asks Me, Where are You going? 6 But because I have said these things to you, sorrow has filled your heart. 7 Nevertheless I tell you the truth. It is to your advantage that I go away; for if I do not go away, the Helper will not come to you; but if I depart, I will send Him to you. 12 I still have many things to say to you, but you cannot bear them now. 13 However, when He, the Spirit of truth, has come, He will guide you into all truth; for He will not speak on His own authority, but whatever He hears He will speak; and He will tell you things to come. 14 He will glorify Me, for He will take of what is Mine and declare it to you. 15 All things that the Father has are Mine. Therefore I said that He will take of Mine and declare it to you.
The word for helper here in the greek is paraclitos, or comforter. The word for the Spirit of truth is Pneuma or wind or breath. The same word always used for the Spirit of God in the new testament, such as in an earlier chapter of John:
Jhn 14:26"But the Helper, the Holy Spirit, whom the Father will send in My name, He will teach you all things, and bring to your remembrance all things that I said to you.
My friend, this is the glorious truth about Jesus! He has come to give us of His Holy Spirit! To bring us back, right now, into fellowship with Him, as pure and Holy children.
The meaning of Paraclitos is not Holy Spirit & Jesus never meant it like that .The real meaning of Periclitos&Paraclitos is -" who praises & who is praised". The Arabic translation of these words are Mohammad & Ahmad. And the Prophet of Islam is known by these two names. John 14, 15 & 16 gives the whole activities of this Prophet. English translators have translated this word as Comforter/Counselor/Helper/Advocate. Note that these English words are also indicating the activities of this Prophet. Prophet of Islam carried out the same activities as described in John 14, 15 & 16.
Jesus very clearly said, I go away to God& ask him to send you the Comforter. Now this Comforter/Counselor/Helper/Advocate is not the Holy Spirit for the following reasons:-
1. Holy Spirit was already available in this earth before the birth of Jesus. Read Luke 1:15-16 which says- "John was full with Holy Spirit when he was in the womb of his mother". Again read Luke 1:35. It says -" Angels told to Mary- Holy Spirit will come upon you & the shadow of Power of God will hover on you." So, question of sending Holy Spirit again from God does not arise. It means Comforter is not Holy Spirit.
2. When Jesus was baptized by John, Holy Spirit came down & filled Jesus. Please read John 1:32 : “Then John gave this witness- I saw the Spirit, like a dove, flying down out of the sky , staying over him”. So, when Jesus was alive, he was filled with Holy Spirit. It is not understood why he will ask God to send something which he already possessed. It must be something different from Holy Spirit.
3. You must be telling, Jesus was having Holy Spirit, but his disciples did not have. So Jesus promised to go up to God & ask God to send Holy Spirit for his disciples. This is also not true. Before going up to God, Jesus called his 11 disciples & filled them with Holy Spirit. Please read John 20:21-23 - Jesus told them-“Peace to you. Just as Father sent me, I send you”. Then he took a deep breath & breathed into them. He said-“ Receive the Holy Spirit. If you forgive someone’s sin, he will be excused. If you do not forgive someone, he will not be excused." Can you see that all his disciples received the Holy Spirit before Jesus went up to God. So, what he promised to send from God for his disciples? Certainly it is not Holy Spirit, because all of his disciples are already having Holy Spirit filled in them. It is that Prophet which is promised in Old & New Testament, which is promised in all other Scriptures of the world including Hindu & Buddha. I will discuss that in my next mail.
At 11:53 AM 5/31/2012, connect@godlife.com wrote:
Dear Khalilur,
I am sorry if I am upsetting you. I must preach the truth. To do otherwise would be unloving/unGodly.
Jesus was born of Mary, a sinner like her parents before her, all the way back to David, Abraham and Adam. Likewise, Jesus was born in a sinful body, however, He was God , almighty God, living within that Body and having the very nature of God, He has never sinned and did not sin while in that body. His death on the cross brought to bear the righteous judgment of God for sin in the flesh. He destroyed the penalty of sin, which is death.
Here is a scripture to help explain what He did.....
Rom 8:3For what the law could not do in that it was weak through the flesh, God [did] by sending His own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh, on account of sin: He condemned sin in the flesh,
Our. Works cannot pay for the sins we have committed. Sure we can do good, but the penalty for the sins remain, which is death.
He took that penalty so we could live!
KHALILUR RAHMAN
What I understand from your this letter that Jesus was born in a body of a sinner, he was carrying sinful seed of Abraham & Adam; yet he did not commit any sin because God was living within him. He was innocent till his crucifixion. It means a man can remain innocent if he does not commit any sin. It also proves that all the infant babies are innocent because they cannot commit any sin. Do you agree to this point?
Jesus also said that the young children are innocent. A man has to be innocent like children to enter the kingdom of God. Please read Luke 18:16-17 , Jesus told them-"Do not stop these children to come to me. Because, the kingdom of God is for the people who are like these children"
There is no proof that God was living inside Jesus from his birth. Jesus received Holy Spirit only when he was baptized by John at the age of 30. If we consider Holy Spirit, John is in better position than Jesus. John received Holy Spirit when he was in the womb of his mother. Luke 1:15-16 says-" John was full with Holy Spirit when he was in the womb of his mother ". And John never committed any sin during his life time. He was innocent in total. He was so innocent that he was ordered by God to baptize Jesus. This innocent Prophet was also killed by the conspiracy of Jews. Now tell me, did John shed his innocent blood to pay for the sin of others?
Another question arises at this point .If Jesus is a God, why he had to be baptized by a man to become purified. Can you imagine a man is baptizing his God?
At 10:47 AM 6/1/2012, connect@godlife.com wrote:
Dear Khalilur,
1. Yes, the Holy Spirit is and always has been. But this does not mean that Jesus was not speaking of the Holy Spirit when He promised that He would send Him.
I know this runs contrary to your fundamental beliefs, but the truth is important.
You incorrectly say that the only word that Jesus used for the Holy Spirit was the word translated comforter. He said He would send another comforter, and that comforter is THE SPIRIT of truth. The word He used for Spirit is pneuma in the Greek .... Here is the actual verse.......
Jhn 15:26 But when the Comforter is come, whom I will send unto you from the Father, [even] the Spirit of truth, which proceedeth from the Father, he shall testify of me:
The Spirit of truth is the Spirit of God, not a prophet. Jesus sent His Holy Spirit. If you really want to know the truth about what Jesus said and did, you must read the Bible. It is God's word about Him.
KHALILUR RAHMAN
Why you are telling me that read Bible. Did I give you any quotation from outside Bible? All I tell you, they are from your Bible. Do you know why you had to try very hard to explain something to me? Because , you are trying to establish something which is not true.. So far, you tried to tell me that Jesus promised to send Holy Spirit to his disciple after going up to God. When I showed you that Disciples of Jesus already had Holy Spirit before Jesus up,
you are now telling me that it is not Holy Spirit but Spirit of Truth.
Do you know what is Spirit of Truth. All the Prophets are the Spirit of Truth from God. They are sent by God & whatever they say, it is truth, nothing but the truth, Abraham was the Spirit of Truth during his time, Moses was the Sprit of Truth during his time, Jesus also the Spirit of Truth during his time.
After Jesus arrives in this world for 2nd time, another man will be sent to assist him. He is also named as "Faithful & Truth". He also carries the Spirit of Truth (Rev 19:11-21).
So, now it is clear that Jesus promised to ask God to send a man with Spirit of Truth who will work as the Helper, Comforter, Counselor & Advocate & he will perform all the activities mentioned in John 14, 15 & 16.
At 12:46 PM 6/1/2012, connect@godlife.com wrote:
Dear Khalilur,
I have appreciated getting to know you and hope we can continue to converse in the future.
For now, it is apparent to me that you do not wish to honestly assess or research the things I say, but simply wish to preach what your religion teaches about the Bible and Jesus, so let's take a break for a while and seek God and allow Him to teach us both.
I have answered each of ( or at least most of) your questions succinctly and specifically from the Bible, and not of my own opinion, yet you seem to ignore the scriptures I send, so it seems that we are at an impasse intellectually.
What do you think? Are you open to hearing what the Bible says?
I have appreciated getting to know you and hope we can continue to converse in the future.
For now, it is apparent to me that you do not wish to honestly assess or research the things I say, but simply wish to preach what your religion teaches about the Bible and Jesus, so let's take a break for a while and seek God and allow Him to teach us both.
I have answered each of ( or at least most of) your questions succinctly and specifically from the Bible, and not of my own opinion, yet you seem to ignore the scriptures I send, so it seems that we are at an impasse intellectually.
What do you think? Are you open to hearing what the Bible says?
KHALILUR RAHMAN
I think you are already exhausted & tired of my
queries. But you must understand that I am from another religion. If I get
support from your Bible in favour of my concept, why I should not avail it. As
an expert of Bible, your duty is to explain it further if you do not accept my
concept. I never quoted from outside Bible. It is all from your book. I feel
the New Testament is very abstract & rhetoric in its statement. It is very
confusing also to a common reader. That is the reason, Paul & his
colleagues had to write additional 23 books to explain 4 books of Gospel. It
becomes difficult for you also to explain something to me. Old Testament is
much more clear & straight forward. There is no ambiguity in its language.
Can you use only old Testament to establish your concept ? Can you prove that Jesus is God or Holy Spirit is God by using Old Testament? Then it will be easy for me to understand.
Very often you are asking me, are you born again? I do not understand what is born again. Can you please explain what you mean exactly. Unless I understand your question, my reply can not satisfy you.
Can you use only old Testament to establish your concept ? Can you prove that Jesus is God or Holy Spirit is God by using Old Testament? Then it will be easy for me to understand.
Very often you are asking me, are you born again? I do not understand what is born again. Can you please explain what you mean exactly. Unless I understand your question, my reply can not satisfy you.
At 06:45 AM 6/4/2012,
connect@godlife.com wrote:
Dear Khalilur,
It's not that I weary at your inquiries, it's that you ignore my responses and simple write back a different line of thought, so it seems like you're actually sincere in your questions, but maybe I misjudged you, I apologize!
You wish for me to show you Jesus from the Old Testament. No problem. Although, I have my doubts that you are seriously going to consider anything I write.
So, before I start on this very long endeavor, I must ask you a few questions about Islam.
1: In the US, many people are concerned that the teachings of your Prophet, when adhered to strictly, lead to acts of violence against others. Not because you are bad people, but because (in our experience) your religion demands that anyone who does not submit to God must be killed. Now, don't get me wrong, that's pretty much in Christianity too, but the difference is this: the One who does the killing is God and He will not do it until He returns, but in our view of Islam (again, as we see it here in the United States), Muslims MUST take vengeance on those who defame the name of Allah or his prophet and it is OK for you to lie to further your cause, since it is deemed most holy. Are these things true?
2: Are you Sunni or Shia?
What country do you live in and were you born into Islam or did you convert?
Dear Khalilur,
It's not that I weary at your inquiries, it's that you ignore my responses and simple write back a different line of thought, so it seems like you're actually sincere in your questions, but maybe I misjudged you, I apologize!
You wish for me to show you Jesus from the Old Testament. No problem. Although, I have my doubts that you are seriously going to consider anything I write.
So, before I start on this very long endeavor, I must ask you a few questions about Islam.
1: In the US, many people are concerned that the teachings of your Prophet, when adhered to strictly, lead to acts of violence against others. Not because you are bad people, but because (in our experience) your religion demands that anyone who does not submit to God must be killed. Now, don't get me wrong, that's pretty much in Christianity too, but the difference is this: the One who does the killing is God and He will not do it until He returns, but in our view of Islam (again, as we see it here in the United States), Muslims MUST take vengeance on those who defame the name of Allah or his prophet and it is OK for you to lie to further your cause, since it is deemed most holy. Are these things true?
2: Are you Sunni or Shia?
What country do you live in and were you born into Islam or did you convert?
KHALILUR RAHMAN
Thanks that you have started communication again.. Let me first give you my personal status. I live in Bangladesh, a born Muslim, Sunni. Although I am a Muslim, almost all the Hindu Scriptures are in my memory. I don't want to say anything about Bible, that you will judge whether I am quoting correctly from Bible or not. So, I have three religions at my disposal from where I can take references. They are Islam, Hindu & Christian.
What you have heard about Islam is not correct. Islam says- Laaikrahafiddin- There is no compulsion in religion. It again says- Lakumdinukumwaliadin- Your religion is for you & my religion is for me. So, you can see that Islam is very liberal. Terrorism is not allowed in Islam at all. Battle of Islam also is regulated by so many Do's & Don't Do's. Indiscriminate killing & destroying of crops & properties are not allowed. If you find some specific verse which needs clarifications, you may ask me. We will discuss on those points. Islam is the continuation of religion of Abraham. So, you will find that it is the up-dated version of Judaism, but suitable for the people of whole world.
Thanks that you have started communication again.. Let me first give you my personal status. I live in Bangladesh, a born Muslim, Sunni. Although I am a Muslim, almost all the Hindu Scriptures are in my memory. I don't want to say anything about Bible, that you will judge whether I am quoting correctly from Bible or not. So, I have three religions at my disposal from where I can take references. They are Islam, Hindu & Christian.
What you have heard about Islam is not correct. Islam says- Laaikrahafiddin- There is no compulsion in religion. It again says- Lakumdinukumwaliadin- Your religion is for you & my religion is for me. So, you can see that Islam is very liberal. Terrorism is not allowed in Islam at all. Battle of Islam also is regulated by so many Do's & Don't Do's. Indiscriminate killing & destroying of crops & properties are not allowed. If you find some specific verse which needs clarifications, you may ask me. We will discuss on those points. Islam is the continuation of religion of Abraham. So, you will find that it is the up-dated version of Judaism, but suitable for the people of whole world.
To tell lie in Islam is not allowed at all. It is a great sin. You cannot
tell lie or take fraudulent action to propagate religion also. Islam is so
clear & transparent that you do not need any lie.
7:03 AM 6/4/2012,
connect@godlife.com wrote:
Dear Khalilur,
You asked me to tell you exactly what Born Again means.....
When Adam and Eve sinned, they died just as God warned them they would. The did not die physically right away, but their eyes were opened and they saw that they were naked.
This opening of their eyes was the Spiritual Death that all people are born with now.
Jesus said, you MUST be born again in order to see the kingdom of God/Heaven.
To be born again means that the Spirit of God Himself comes into your being you receive new life.You literally become a NEW creature! You are now born of the Spirit of God.
So, to recap: The be born again, means that God Himself has taken up residence within your heart and you are now a new type of being. You are no longer born just of the seed of Adam, but now of God!
You asked me to tell you exactly what Born Again means.....
When Adam and Eve sinned, they died just as God warned them they would. The did not die physically right away, but their eyes were opened and they saw that they were naked.
This opening of their eyes was the Spiritual Death that all people are born with now.
Jesus said, you MUST be born again in order to see the kingdom of God/Heaven.
To be born again means that the Spirit of God Himself comes into your being you receive new life.You literally become a NEW creature! You are now born of the Spirit of God.
So, to recap: The be born again, means that God Himself has taken up residence within your heart and you are now a new type of being. You are no longer born just of the seed of Adam, but now of God!
KHALILUR RAHMAN
What I understand from your this letter, the death means spiritually dead & you are born again when you are filled with spirit of God. Adam & Eve committed sin & they became spiritually dead. They were reborn when they received the spirit of God. Same happened to Abraham, Moses , David & their followers as well. They were spiritually dead & when they received the Spirit of God, they were reborn again. Am I correct till now? Please confirm that I am correct till now.
At 07:59 AM 6/5/2012, connect@godlife.com wrote:
Dear Khalilur,
Well, not exactly....
Before Christ died, no one could be born again. So Adam, Eve, Moses, Abraham and all the prophets were not born again. They may have had the Spirit of God with them, but they were still only born of the seed of Adam and they were of his fallen nature.
Jesus' death is the only thing that wipes away our list of sins and unless one is washed in the blood of the lamb (Jesus), they are still dead in their trespasses and sins.
To be born again means that your very nature becomes new. You are now daily transformed into the image of the Son of God and the ultimate end will be when you go to heaven and you will see Him and you will be like Him, for you are born of His Spirit.
What I understand from your this letter, the death means spiritually dead & you are born again when you are filled with spirit of God. Adam & Eve committed sin & they became spiritually dead. They were reborn when they received the spirit of God. Same happened to Abraham, Moses , David & their followers as well. They were spiritually dead & when they received the Spirit of God, they were reborn again. Am I correct till now? Please confirm that I am correct till now.
At 07:59 AM 6/5/2012, connect@godlife.com wrote:
Dear Khalilur,
Well, not exactly....
Before Christ died, no one could be born again. So Adam, Eve, Moses, Abraham and all the prophets were not born again. They may have had the Spirit of God with them, but they were still only born of the seed of Adam and they were of his fallen nature.
Jesus' death is the only thing that wipes away our list of sins and unless one is washed in the blood of the lamb (Jesus), they are still dead in their trespasses and sins.
To be born again means that your very nature becomes new. You are now daily transformed into the image of the Son of God and the ultimate end will be when you go to heaven and you will see Him and you will be like Him, for you are born of His Spirit.
KHALILUR RAHMAN
What you mean is that Adam, Noah, Abraham, Moses & David did not get Salvation & they will not go to heaven to stay with God. Similar status for their followers also, am I correct?
At 09:20 AM 6/5/2012, you wrote:
Dear Khalilur,
What you mean is that Adam, Noah, Abraham, Moses & David did not get Salvation & they will not go to heaven to stay with God. Similar status for their followers also, am I correct?
At 09:20 AM 6/5/2012, you wrote:
Dear Khalilur,
Who is the 'We' in this verse of the Quar'an?50:6SuratQaf
(Sahih International)
“Have they not looked at the heaven above them - how We structured it and adorned it and [how] it has no rifts?”
KHALILUR RAHMAN
This is the style of Arabic language & of many other language also. For respect, they use plural instead of singular. When your President gives speech, he never says- "I have done this". Rather he says- We have done this.. This is the style. "We" does not mean that God is plural. Qur'an says- " He is Allah the One and Only , Allah the Eternal Absolute , He neither beget nor is He begotten , and there is none like unto Him"
“Have they not looked at the heaven above them - how We structured it and adorned it and [how] it has no rifts?”
KHALILUR RAHMAN
This is the style of Arabic language & of many other language also. For respect, they use plural instead of singular. When your President gives speech, he never says- "I have done this". Rather he says- We have done this.. This is the style. "We" does not mean that God is plural. Qur'an says- " He is Allah the One and Only , Allah the Eternal Absolute , He neither beget nor is He begotten , and there is none like unto Him"
At 11:35 AM 6/5/2012, connect@godlife.com wrote:
Dear Khalilur,
I found this verse in the Quar'an, it appears that you cannot actually believe anything I say as a Christian, since to do so would apparently be to reject Allah.
Surat al Bakarah 2:120.....And never will the Jews or the Christians approve of you until you follow their religion. Say, "Indeed, the guidance of Allah is the [only] guidance." If you were to follow their desires after what has come to you of knowledge, you would have against Allah; no protector or helper.
I believe God is big enough and loving enough and perfect enough to handle any question We have. I also believe that God said if we seek Him with all of our heart we will find Him.
What proof do you have that your religion is the truth of God? I mean , if I was to follow your religion, how can I know that it is the truth path of God, as opposed to Hindu, Jehovah's witness, Mormon, Zoroasterism, Humanism, etc. etc.
KHALILUR RAHMAN
It is good that you have also started quoting from Qur'an. Qur'an itself is an everlasting miracle of God. You read the verses related to Jesus or Moses or Abraham & about many other Prophets, you will find the truth in it. Qur'an speaks many things about this universe, about sun, moon & stars, about nature, water cycles, embryology etc. But you will not find a single verse which is conflicting with the modern science. This is the miracle of Qur’an. Qur’an itself is also the light, way to God.
If you talk about the miracles of Prophet of Islam, there are hundreds of them, much more than the miracles of Jesus. Description of these miracles is not in Qur'an. If you read Hadith, you will find them all. Daily activities of the Prophet, his speeches, his actions, advices, miracles, in short, his whole life is described in Hadith.
God had sent all his Prophets with some specific miracles as a proof that he has come from God. Prophet of Islam also had them. But his everlasting miracle is the Qur'an which will remain in this world till Doom's Day & anybody can test its truth.
Prophet of Islam is the way of life for whole mankind, he is the light of Truth. Whole Universe is blessed by him. God said to Abraham- "In your seed all the nations of the earth shall be blessed, because you have obeyed My voice."" Gen 22:18 . Prophet of Islam is the seed of Abraham through his first born son Ismail.
I found this verse in the Quar'an, it appears that you cannot actually believe anything I say as a Christian, since to do so would apparently be to reject Allah.
Surat al Bakarah 2:120.....And never will the Jews or the Christians approve of you until you follow their religion. Say, "Indeed, the guidance of Allah is the [only] guidance." If you were to follow their desires after what has come to you of knowledge, you would have against Allah; no protector or helper.
I believe God is big enough and loving enough and perfect enough to handle any question We have. I also believe that God said if we seek Him with all of our heart we will find Him.
What proof do you have that your religion is the truth of God? I mean , if I was to follow your religion, how can I know that it is the truth path of God, as opposed to Hindu, Jehovah's witness, Mormon, Zoroasterism, Humanism, etc. etc.
KHALILUR RAHMAN
It is good that you have also started quoting from Qur'an. Qur'an itself is an everlasting miracle of God. You read the verses related to Jesus or Moses or Abraham & about many other Prophets, you will find the truth in it. Qur'an speaks many things about this universe, about sun, moon & stars, about nature, water cycles, embryology etc. But you will not find a single verse which is conflicting with the modern science. This is the miracle of Qur’an. Qur’an itself is also the light, way to God.
If you talk about the miracles of Prophet of Islam, there are hundreds of them, much more than the miracles of Jesus. Description of these miracles is not in Qur'an. If you read Hadith, you will find them all. Daily activities of the Prophet, his speeches, his actions, advices, miracles, in short, his whole life is described in Hadith.
God had sent all his Prophets with some specific miracles as a proof that he has come from God. Prophet of Islam also had them. But his everlasting miracle is the Qur'an which will remain in this world till Doom's Day & anybody can test its truth.
Prophet of Islam is the way of life for whole mankind, he is the light of Truth. Whole Universe is blessed by him. God said to Abraham- "In your seed all the nations of the earth shall be blessed, because you have obeyed My voice."" Gen 22:18 . Prophet of Islam is the seed of Abraham through his first born son Ismail.
At 10:26
AM 6/5/2012, connect@godlife.com wrote:
Dear Khalilur,
Here's some old testament scriptures showing that Jesus is the Son of God and God the Son .......
Isa 7:14"Therefore the Lord Himself will give you a sign: Behold, the virgin shall conceive and bear a Son, and shall call His name Immanuel.
The name Immanuel means "God with us" . So, does this mean that God was with us in Jesus or that by sending Jesus God was telling us that He is 'with' us in the sense that He is for us?
Here are verses written in Psalm 2. Who is speaking?
Psa 2:7-12 "I will declare the decree: The LORD has said to Me, 'You [are] My Son, Today I have begotten You. Ask of Me, and I will give [You] The nations [for] Your inheritance, And the ends of the earth [for] Your possession. You shall break [fn] them with a rod of iron; You shall dash them to pieces like a potter's vessel.' "
" Serve the LORD with fear, And rejoice with trembling. Kiss the Son, [fn] lest He [fn] be angry, And you perish [in] the way, When His wrath is kindled but a little. Blessed [are] all those who put their trust in Him.
Again who is speaking here? I believe this is Jesus, the Son of God, who has the right and reason to tell people to trust in Him.
Ok, once again here is a scripture foretelling the coming of Jesus, the Son of God, as also being called "the mighty God".
Isa 9:6For unto us a Child is born, Unto us a Son is given; And the government will be upon His shoulder. And His name will be called Wonderful, Counselor, Mighty God, Everlasting Father, Prince of Peace.
Notice all the names the Lord gives to His Son! The mighty God! Everlasting Father! Wonderful, Counselor! God labels Jesus with terms that refer to He Himself.
I think God is making it very clear that Jesus was not just a prophet. He was the only begotten of the Father, full of grace and truth.
Dear Khalilur,
Here's some old testament scriptures showing that Jesus is the Son of God and God the Son .......
Isa 7:14"Therefore the Lord Himself will give you a sign: Behold, the virgin shall conceive and bear a Son, and shall call His name Immanuel.
The name Immanuel means "God with us" . So, does this mean that God was with us in Jesus or that by sending Jesus God was telling us that He is 'with' us in the sense that He is for us?
Here are verses written in Psalm 2. Who is speaking?
Psa 2:7-12 "I will declare the decree: The LORD has said to Me, 'You [are] My Son, Today I have begotten You. Ask of Me, and I will give [You] The nations [for] Your inheritance, And the ends of the earth [for] Your possession. You shall break [fn] them with a rod of iron; You shall dash them to pieces like a potter's vessel.' "
" Serve the LORD with fear, And rejoice with trembling. Kiss the Son, [fn] lest He [fn] be angry, And you perish [in] the way, When His wrath is kindled but a little. Blessed [are] all those who put their trust in Him.
Again who is speaking here? I believe this is Jesus, the Son of God, who has the right and reason to tell people to trust in Him.
Ok, once again here is a scripture foretelling the coming of Jesus, the Son of God, as also being called "the mighty God".
Isa 9:6For unto us a Child is born, Unto us a Son is given; And the government will be upon His shoulder. And His name will be called Wonderful, Counselor, Mighty God, Everlasting Father, Prince of Peace.
Notice all the names the Lord gives to His Son! The mighty God! Everlasting Father! Wonderful, Counselor! God labels Jesus with terms that refer to He Himself.
I think God is making it very clear that Jesus was not just a prophet. He was the only begotten of the Father, full of grace and truth.
KHALILUR
RAHMAN
I have again read Isaiah today. These are the visions saw by Isaiah regarding Judah & Jerusalem during the times of kings Uzziah, Jotham, Ahaz& Hezekiah ( Isa 1:1).. It does not have any relation with Jesus. It will be more clear about this son you are talking about when you read the next verse of Isa 7:15. It says- " By the time the child is 12 years old, able to make moral decision, the threat of war will be over. Relax, those two kings that have you so worried will be out of picture." Jesus was never known at the age of 12. His identity was disclosed at the age of 30. Neither those two kings were present during the time of Jesus. So it is not Jesus. Your interpretation is very wrong.
At 09:04 AM 6/6/2012, connect@godlife.com wrote:
I have again read Isaiah today. These are the visions saw by Isaiah regarding Judah & Jerusalem during the times of kings Uzziah, Jotham, Ahaz& Hezekiah ( Isa 1:1).. It does not have any relation with Jesus. It will be more clear about this son you are talking about when you read the next verse of Isa 7:15. It says- " By the time the child is 12 years old, able to make moral decision, the threat of war will be over. Relax, those two kings that have you so worried will be out of picture." Jesus was never known at the age of 12. His identity was disclosed at the age of 30. Neither those two kings were present during the time of Jesus. So it is not Jesus. Your interpretation is very wrong.
At 09:04 AM 6/6/2012, connect@godlife.com wrote:
Dear
Khalilur,
You asked if Adam, Moses, etc. did not go to heaven because they had not been born again..
What you need to understand is the depth of the depravity of man when compared to The One and Only Holy God Almighty and the true nature of the redemption offered by Christ on the cross.
Psa 14:2The LORD looks down from heaven upon the children of men, To see if there are any who understand, who seek God. 14:3They have all turned aside, They have together become corrupt; [There is] none who does good, No, not one.
Just as you believe, man is responsible for their sins. The soul that sins, shall die. And since ALL have sinned, all must die.
God said to Adam and Eve that they may eat of all the fruit of the garden, except the fruit of the tree in the midst of the garden he said that SURELY in the day that you eat of it, you will die.
When Jesus died on the cross, He took upon Himself the Penalty for the sin of Adam and for all of our sins as well. And when He died, He descended into the place of the dead and He released those people of faith who were unable to enter Heaven because of the sin of Adam, and "took captivity, captive" and lead them into heaven.
So, Adam, Moses, Abraham, Enoch, all who practiced righteousness were saved, but not by the good works they did, per se, but by the finished work of the cross. While it is true that their good works did secure them a place inAbrahamsbosom, there was no way their goodness could wash away the stain of sin that they bore.
So, those before Christ were saved (delivered from death and passed onto life) by the death and resurrection of Christ, just as we are today.
Anyone who thinks that by keeping the law of God and/or by following His prophets that they will find favor in His sight on the day of judgment is sadly mistaken.
He said that TODAY is the day of salvation. The day of judgment is just that...judgment. It is not a time to be saved. It is the time to be judged according to your works, and remember, your works cannot pay the price for sin.
No, in fact the very works that you point to as the basis for your salvation will actually prove that you knew what was right to do, and that while you KNOW that you were unable to keep all of Gods laws, you clung to trying to keep those commands as they way you could be saved instead of bowing before Gods righteous judgment poured out on His Holy and beloved Son Jesus.
KHALILUR RAHMAN
What was my questions & what is your reply? I asked very specifically whether according to your opinion, do you mean that Adam, Noah, Abraham, Moses & David did not get Salvation & they will not go to heaven to stay with God? You please study your Bible & give me your final decision about them.
You asked if Adam, Moses, etc. did not go to heaven because they had not been born again..
What you need to understand is the depth of the depravity of man when compared to The One and Only Holy God Almighty and the true nature of the redemption offered by Christ on the cross.
Psa 14:2The LORD looks down from heaven upon the children of men, To see if there are any who understand, who seek God. 14:3They have all turned aside, They have together become corrupt; [There is] none who does good, No, not one.
Just as you believe, man is responsible for their sins. The soul that sins, shall die. And since ALL have sinned, all must die.
God said to Adam and Eve that they may eat of all the fruit of the garden, except the fruit of the tree in the midst of the garden he said that SURELY in the day that you eat of it, you will die.
When Jesus died on the cross, He took upon Himself the Penalty for the sin of Adam and for all of our sins as well. And when He died, He descended into the place of the dead and He released those people of faith who were unable to enter Heaven because of the sin of Adam, and "took captivity, captive" and lead them into heaven.
So, Adam, Moses, Abraham, Enoch, all who practiced righteousness were saved, but not by the good works they did, per se, but by the finished work of the cross. While it is true that their good works did secure them a place inAbrahamsbosom, there was no way their goodness could wash away the stain of sin that they bore.
So, those before Christ were saved (delivered from death and passed onto life) by the death and resurrection of Christ, just as we are today.
Anyone who thinks that by keeping the law of God and/or by following His prophets that they will find favor in His sight on the day of judgment is sadly mistaken.
He said that TODAY is the day of salvation. The day of judgment is just that...judgment. It is not a time to be saved. It is the time to be judged according to your works, and remember, your works cannot pay the price for sin.
No, in fact the very works that you point to as the basis for your salvation will actually prove that you knew what was right to do, and that while you KNOW that you were unable to keep all of Gods laws, you clung to trying to keep those commands as they way you could be saved instead of bowing before Gods righteous judgment poured out on His Holy and beloved Son Jesus.
KHALILUR RAHMAN
What was my questions & what is your reply? I asked very specifically whether according to your opinion, do you mean that Adam, Noah, Abraham, Moses & David did not get Salvation & they will not go to heaven to stay with God? You please study your Bible & give me your final decision about them.
.At 09:16
AM 6/6/2012, connect@godlife.com wrote:
Dear Khalilur,
Well, it seems we are at an impasse. I believe your religion is not of God and you believe my religion is not of God.
Can we both be correct?
KHALILUR RAHMAN
No, your deduction is not correct. I believe , my religion is of God & I believe, your religion is also from God. But you are highly misguided & deviated from the religion of Jesus. If you follow the true path of Old & New Testament, then there is no difference between you & me. Please read the following verses from Old Testament:
Isaiah 11:1-4 A green Shoot will sprout from Jesses stump, from his roots a budding Branch. The life giving Spirit of God will hover over him, the spirit that brings wisdom & understanding, the spirit that gives directions & builds strength, the spirit that instills knowledge & Fear-of-God. Fear-of-God will be all his joy & delight. He wont judge by appearance, wont decide on the basis of hearsay. He will judge the needy by what is right, render decisions on earth’s poor with justice.
Note here what the Spirit of God means. Most important here is the Fear-of-God. There is no difference between you & me when Fear-of-God becomes your joy & delight. And you will get Salvation when you surrender to God whole heartedly in total as given in the following verse from your Bible:
Isaiah 12:2 Yes, indeed, God is my salvation. I trust, I wont be afraid. God, yes God is my strength & song, best of all my salvation."
At 12:03 PM 6/6/2012, connect@godlife.com wrote:
Dear Khalilur,
Well, it seems we are at an impasse. I believe your religion is not of God and you believe my religion is not of God.
Can we both be correct?
KHALILUR RAHMAN
No, your deduction is not correct. I believe , my religion is of God & I believe, your religion is also from God. But you are highly misguided & deviated from the religion of Jesus. If you follow the true path of Old & New Testament, then there is no difference between you & me. Please read the following verses from Old Testament:
Isaiah 11:1-4 A green Shoot will sprout from Jesses stump, from his roots a budding Branch. The life giving Spirit of God will hover over him, the spirit that brings wisdom & understanding, the spirit that gives directions & builds strength, the spirit that instills knowledge & Fear-of-God. Fear-of-God will be all his joy & delight. He wont judge by appearance, wont decide on the basis of hearsay. He will judge the needy by what is right, render decisions on earth’s poor with justice.
Note here what the Spirit of God means. Most important here is the Fear-of-God. There is no difference between you & me when Fear-of-God becomes your joy & delight. And you will get Salvation when you surrender to God whole heartedly in total as given in the following verse from your Bible:
Isaiah 12:2 Yes, indeed, God is my salvation. I trust, I wont be afraid. God, yes God is my strength & song, best of all my salvation."
At 12:03 PM 6/6/2012, connect@godlife.com wrote:
Dear Khalilur,
Please read the end of my message, the answer was written very plainly there. Sorry it took so long to get to.
Perhaps my answer was too long for you to read?
It's clear what I wrote. Look toward the end of my response .
They were not in heaven until Jesus died on the cross. whether they are in heaven at all, I would not know. I am not God. Whoever believes will be saved, so if they believed , they are there.
KHALILUR RAHMAN
I understand that you are in doubt whether hundreds of Messengers of God who came before Jesus will go to heaven or not.. It is a very serious allegation. Take the example of Moses. Throughout his Prophet hood, Moses talked to God directly. You think he will not go to heaven? What about Abraham? God declared him as his friend. The whole world is blessed by his seed. You think he will not go to heaven? All the Prophets of God were guided by the Spirit of God & were declared innocent by God. They will lead their followers & enter into the heaven one after another. Your this Paulian concept is very dangerous. This will ruin the basis of your faith.
In fact, your theory of sinful seeds is totally wrong. It is beyond of any logical conclusion & does not have any Biblical support also.. Bible says, no son will be responsible for the sin of his father & vice versa. Everybody has to carry his own burden. Please read this verse from Old Testament.
Ezekiel 18:20 The soul that sins is the soul that dies. The child does not share the guilt of the parent, nor the parent the guilt of the child. If you live upright & well, you get the credit; if you live a wicked life, you are guilty as charged.
If you want to know the details of it, please read the whole chapter from Ezekiel 18. Very clearly it is declared by God that no son will bear the sin of his father & no father will bear the sin of his son. If Adam did some sin, his descendants are not responsible at all for that sin. So, the concept of dying on the cross for the sin of somebody else, is totally wrong& ridiculous..
Please read the end of my message, the answer was written very plainly there. Sorry it took so long to get to.
Perhaps my answer was too long for you to read?
It's clear what I wrote. Look toward the end of my response .
They were not in heaven until Jesus died on the cross. whether they are in heaven at all, I would not know. I am not God. Whoever believes will be saved, so if they believed , they are there.
KHALILUR RAHMAN
I understand that you are in doubt whether hundreds of Messengers of God who came before Jesus will go to heaven or not.. It is a very serious allegation. Take the example of Moses. Throughout his Prophet hood, Moses talked to God directly. You think he will not go to heaven? What about Abraham? God declared him as his friend. The whole world is blessed by his seed. You think he will not go to heaven? All the Prophets of God were guided by the Spirit of God & were declared innocent by God. They will lead their followers & enter into the heaven one after another. Your this Paulian concept is very dangerous. This will ruin the basis of your faith.
In fact, your theory of sinful seeds is totally wrong. It is beyond of any logical conclusion & does not have any Biblical support also.. Bible says, no son will be responsible for the sin of his father & vice versa. Everybody has to carry his own burden. Please read this verse from Old Testament.
Ezekiel 18:20 The soul that sins is the soul that dies. The child does not share the guilt of the parent, nor the parent the guilt of the child. If you live upright & well, you get the credit; if you live a wicked life, you are guilty as charged.
If you want to know the details of it, please read the whole chapter from Ezekiel 18. Very clearly it is declared by God that no son will bear the sin of his father & no father will bear the sin of his son. If Adam did some sin, his descendants are not responsible at all for that sin. So, the concept of dying on the cross for the sin of somebody else, is totally wrong& ridiculous..
12:02 PM 6/7/2012,
connect@godlife.com wrote:
Dear Khalilur,
This is the way the verse you quoted is written in the New King James Version:
Isaiah 11:1-4
"There shall come forth a Rod from the stem of Jesse, And a Branch shall grow out of his roots. The Spirit of the LORD shall rest upon Him, The Spirit of wisdom and understanding, The Spirit of counsel and might, The Spirit of knowledge and of the fear of the LORD. His delight is in the fear of the LORD, And He shall not judge by the sight of His eyes, Nor decide by the hearing of His ears; But with righteousness He shall judge the poor, And decide with equity for the meek of the earth; He shall strike the earth with the rod of His mouth, And with the breath of His lips He shall slay the wicked."
I believe you rightly pointed out that this verse is speaking of Jesus. And how the Holy Spirit would rest upon Him and He would have wisdom and understanding, counsel and might, knowledge and the fear of the LORD.
Notice that this same Jesus will " strike the earth with the rod of His mouth, and with the breath of His lips He shall slay the wicked.".
This same Jesus is the one before whom all mankind will stand and give an account for their lives. For He will return as the judge of the whole earth.
This is what the Bible teaches, do you agree?
KHALILUR RAHMAN
This is the example of how whimsically you people translate the Bible in English. Every Tom & Harry translating it as per his concept & requirement. There is no standard at all because no original text is available. My Bible, while translating this portion, has stressed on the phrase Fear-of-God . He has used all capital letters as I showed here. If you apply this passage for Jesus, note that he will have Fear-of-God instilled in him & he will be delighted & joyful by his Fear-of-God. Here, very easily you can judge the status of Jesus compared to God Almighty. This teaching of Bible is for you people also. Have Fear of God as Jesus had & judge people with Justice & righteousness.
Dear Khalilur,
This is the way the verse you quoted is written in the New King James Version:
Isaiah 11:1-4
"There shall come forth a Rod from the stem of Jesse, And a Branch shall grow out of his roots. The Spirit of the LORD shall rest upon Him, The Spirit of wisdom and understanding, The Spirit of counsel and might, The Spirit of knowledge and of the fear of the LORD. His delight is in the fear of the LORD, And He shall not judge by the sight of His eyes, Nor decide by the hearing of His ears; But with righteousness He shall judge the poor, And decide with equity for the meek of the earth; He shall strike the earth with the rod of His mouth, And with the breath of His lips He shall slay the wicked."
I believe you rightly pointed out that this verse is speaking of Jesus. And how the Holy Spirit would rest upon Him and He would have wisdom and understanding, counsel and might, knowledge and the fear of the LORD.
Notice that this same Jesus will " strike the earth with the rod of His mouth, and with the breath of His lips He shall slay the wicked.".
This same Jesus is the one before whom all mankind will stand and give an account for their lives. For He will return as the judge of the whole earth.
This is what the Bible teaches, do you agree?
KHALILUR RAHMAN
This is the example of how whimsically you people translate the Bible in English. Every Tom & Harry translating it as per his concept & requirement. There is no standard at all because no original text is available. My Bible, while translating this portion, has stressed on the phrase Fear-of-God . He has used all capital letters as I showed here. If you apply this passage for Jesus, note that he will have Fear-of-God instilled in him & he will be delighted & joyful by his Fear-of-God. Here, very easily you can judge the status of Jesus compared to God Almighty. This teaching of Bible is for you people also. Have Fear of God as Jesus had & judge people with Justice & righteousness.
At 10:47 AM 6/7/2012,
connect@godlife.com wrote:
Dear Khalilur,
I did not say that they would not go to heaven, I said I am not God, so I do not know who will go to heaven.I am not the judge. Are you able to say who will go to heaven?
As for the sins of the father, that's completely irrelevant anyway.Why? Because EVERYONE sins.
Now, I MUST make a point. You keep quoting the Bible, yet you TOTALLY reject the Bible as the Word of God.You are being intellectually dishonest by using some of the Bible, yet rejecting other portions.Either it is the Word of God, or NOT. You can't have it both ways.
OK, as to your question: sure the scriptures DO say in Ezekiel 18 what you say it says, that God will hold each person accountable for their own sin and not those of their father. However, you must consider what the Lord has previously said and read, IN CONTEXT when He was speaking through Ezekiel, to whom He was speaking and why. Ezekiel was sent to the Jews who were rebelling against God.
The following is the appearance of the Lord to Moses:
"And the LORD passed before him and proclaimed, "The LORD, the LORD God, merciful and gracious, longsuffering, and abounding in goodness and truth," - (Exd 34:6 NKJV)
""keeping mercy for thousands, forgiving iniquity and transgression and sin, by no means clearing the guilty, visiting the iniquity of the fathers upon the children and the children's children to the third and the fourth generation."" - (Exd 34:7 NKJV)
Obviously the Lord DOES visit the iniquity of the fathers on their children, grand children and even great-grand children!
Dear Khalilur,
I did not say that they would not go to heaven, I said I am not God, so I do not know who will go to heaven.I am not the judge. Are you able to say who will go to heaven?
As for the sins of the father, that's completely irrelevant anyway.Why? Because EVERYONE sins.
Now, I MUST make a point. You keep quoting the Bible, yet you TOTALLY reject the Bible as the Word of God.You are being intellectually dishonest by using some of the Bible, yet rejecting other portions.Either it is the Word of God, or NOT. You can't have it both ways.
OK, as to your question: sure the scriptures DO say in Ezekiel 18 what you say it says, that God will hold each person accountable for their own sin and not those of their father. However, you must consider what the Lord has previously said and read, IN CONTEXT when He was speaking through Ezekiel, to whom He was speaking and why. Ezekiel was sent to the Jews who were rebelling against God.
The following is the appearance of the Lord to Moses:
"And the LORD passed before him and proclaimed, "The LORD, the LORD God, merciful and gracious, longsuffering, and abounding in goodness and truth," - (Exd 34:6 NKJV)
""keeping mercy for thousands, forgiving iniquity and transgression and sin, by no means clearing the guilty, visiting the iniquity of the fathers upon the children and the children's children to the third and the fourth generation."" - (Exd 34:7 NKJV)
Obviously the Lord DOES visit the iniquity of the fathers on their children, grand children and even great-grand children!
Here is an awesome portion of
scripture where the LORD deals with the idea of the children being responsible
for the sins of their fathers and how the LORD would deal with this issue:
Jeremiah 31: 29-34 "In those days they shall say no more: 'The fathers have eaten sour grapes, And the children's teeth are set on edge.'" -"But every one shall die for his own iniquity; every man who eats the sour grapes, his teeth shall be set on edge." -"Behold, the days are coming, says the LORD, when I will makea new covenant with the house of Israel and with the house of Judah--not according to the covenant that I made with their fathers in the day that I took them by the hand to lead them out of the land of Egypt, My covenant which they broke, though I was a husband to them, says the LORD. But this is the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel after those days, says the LORD: I will put My law in their minds, and write it on their hearts; and I will be their God, and they shall be My people. No more shall every man teach his neighbor, and every man his brother, saying, 'Know the LORD,' for they all shall know Me, from the least of them to the greatest of them, says the LORD. For I will forgive their iniquity, and their sin I will remember no more."
Here we have the LORD declaring His NEW Covenant. This is the Covenant that Jesus spoke of at His last supper.
(Here's the actual verse in Matthew (not Paul), where Jesus spoke of the New Covenant.:
Matthew: 26:26-28 : "And as they were eating, Jesus took bread, blessed and broke it, and gave it to the disciples and said, "Take, eat; this is My body."" Then He took the cup, and gave thanks, and gave it to them, saying, "Drink from it, all of you. For this is My blood of the new covenant, which is shed for many for the remission of sins."
You often quote Jesus when you write. Here Jesus said that He shed His blood for the remission of sins.Was He lying? Was this verse NOT the Word of God, but the others were?You must either completely reject the Bible and the Jesus of the Bible, or you must completely accept the Bible and the Jesus of the Bible.
KHALILUR RAHMAN
God has confirmed that all His Messengers will go to Heaven. God has also confirmed that 10 companions of Prophet Mohammad (PBUH) will go to heaven. I do not know about you & me. But I hope that I will go to heaven, Insha-Allah.
Every body does not do sin. All infants are born innocent & sinless. They may commit sin when they are adult. Qur'an & Bible confirms that John, the Baptist, never did sin during his whole life.
As I said before, Bible is a mixture. It has words of God, it has words of Messengers of God, it has words of the Pharisees & other priests, it contains the research & explanation of Paul & other Saints When it is translated by different people, it has lost its originality & become the supporter of the concept of its translators. So, you have to filter out which one is God's word & which one is interpolated. That is why it has so much contradictions& you have to find out the hidden meanings to establish your concept.
You have quoted from Exodus 34:6-7. If you read further you will see that God is talking to Moses before making a covenant with the people of Israel. God said, if you do not follow this covenant, the adverse result will fall on you, on your children & even on your grandchildren. Later on we see that it is happening to them. When the Jews disobeyed the order to enter a city, God made them roaming in the desert for 40 years, thus suffered their children & grandchildren. After that they could enter a city.
You have quoted from Jeremiah 31:29-34. Again read Jeremiah 31:30. It says- "Each person will pay for his own sin. You eat green apple, you are the one to get sick". It is so clearly mentioned here that nobody can pay for your sin. You have to pay for your own sin. So, Jesus cannot pay for your sin. You will be responsible for your sin.
In Jeremiah 31:29-34, God said that He is going to make a brand new Covenant with Israel & Judah. You are claiming that it is Jesus who made a new covenant. Jesus did not abrogate the Covenant of Moses & did not give any new covenant. He informed the people that the time is approaching for God's kingdom & for a new covenant. He warned people to remain vigilance for God's Kingdom. But he did not establish the God's Kingdom himself, neither he gave any new covenant. It is the Prophet of Islam who has established the Kingdom of God & God has given a brand new covenant through him. When Jesus will come back again, he will follow this new covenant of Islam and rule this kingdom of God as a Muslim. If you read Revelation very analytically, you will find out all these facts.
Jeremiah 31: 29-34 "In those days they shall say no more: 'The fathers have eaten sour grapes, And the children's teeth are set on edge.'" -"But every one shall die for his own iniquity; every man who eats the sour grapes, his teeth shall be set on edge." -"Behold, the days are coming, says the LORD, when I will makea new covenant with the house of Israel and with the house of Judah--not according to the covenant that I made with their fathers in the day that I took them by the hand to lead them out of the land of Egypt, My covenant which they broke, though I was a husband to them, says the LORD. But this is the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel after those days, says the LORD: I will put My law in their minds, and write it on their hearts; and I will be their God, and they shall be My people. No more shall every man teach his neighbor, and every man his brother, saying, 'Know the LORD,' for they all shall know Me, from the least of them to the greatest of them, says the LORD. For I will forgive their iniquity, and their sin I will remember no more."
Here we have the LORD declaring His NEW Covenant. This is the Covenant that Jesus spoke of at His last supper.
(Here's the actual verse in Matthew (not Paul), where Jesus spoke of the New Covenant.:
Matthew: 26:26-28 : "And as they were eating, Jesus took bread, blessed and broke it, and gave it to the disciples and said, "Take, eat; this is My body."" Then He took the cup, and gave thanks, and gave it to them, saying, "Drink from it, all of you. For this is My blood of the new covenant, which is shed for many for the remission of sins."
You often quote Jesus when you write. Here Jesus said that He shed His blood for the remission of sins.Was He lying? Was this verse NOT the Word of God, but the others were?You must either completely reject the Bible and the Jesus of the Bible, or you must completely accept the Bible and the Jesus of the Bible.
KHALILUR RAHMAN
God has confirmed that all His Messengers will go to Heaven. God has also confirmed that 10 companions of Prophet Mohammad (PBUH) will go to heaven. I do not know about you & me. But I hope that I will go to heaven, Insha-Allah.
Every body does not do sin. All infants are born innocent & sinless. They may commit sin when they are adult. Qur'an & Bible confirms that John, the Baptist, never did sin during his whole life.
As I said before, Bible is a mixture. It has words of God, it has words of Messengers of God, it has words of the Pharisees & other priests, it contains the research & explanation of Paul & other Saints When it is translated by different people, it has lost its originality & become the supporter of the concept of its translators. So, you have to filter out which one is God's word & which one is interpolated. That is why it has so much contradictions& you have to find out the hidden meanings to establish your concept.
You have quoted from Exodus 34:6-7. If you read further you will see that God is talking to Moses before making a covenant with the people of Israel. God said, if you do not follow this covenant, the adverse result will fall on you, on your children & even on your grandchildren. Later on we see that it is happening to them. When the Jews disobeyed the order to enter a city, God made them roaming in the desert for 40 years, thus suffered their children & grandchildren. After that they could enter a city.
You have quoted from Jeremiah 31:29-34. Again read Jeremiah 31:30. It says- "Each person will pay for his own sin. You eat green apple, you are the one to get sick". It is so clearly mentioned here that nobody can pay for your sin. You have to pay for your own sin. So, Jesus cannot pay for your sin. You will be responsible for your sin.
In Jeremiah 31:29-34, God said that He is going to make a brand new Covenant with Israel & Judah. You are claiming that it is Jesus who made a new covenant. Jesus did not abrogate the Covenant of Moses & did not give any new covenant. He informed the people that the time is approaching for God's kingdom & for a new covenant. He warned people to remain vigilance for God's Kingdom. But he did not establish the God's Kingdom himself, neither he gave any new covenant. It is the Prophet of Islam who has established the Kingdom of God & God has given a brand new covenant through him. When Jesus will come back again, he will follow this new covenant of Islam and rule this kingdom of God as a Muslim. If you read Revelation very analytically, you will find out all these facts.
At 09:19
AM 6/8/2012, connect@godlife.com wrote:
Dear Khalilur,
Amen! The fear of the Lord is the
beginning of life!
I could not agree more! To do rightly, to love justice, to walk humbly with our God is the whole will of God for man.
So why do people reject His free gift? It is because the fear of God is not truly in them.
To fear God is to submit to what He says.
The problem with people is that they have rejected His Word. They accuse God, saying that He was unable to keep His book pure.
They deny the authority of scripture by doubting that Jesus was telling the truth when He said ' heaven and earth shall pass away, But MY words will by no means pass away." Mark 13:31
They deny the Father, for they reject the Son.
1Jo 2:23Whoever denies the Son does not have the Father either; he who acknowledges the Son has the Father also.
KHALILUR RAHMAN
It is clear from your argument & logic that you people do not believe in Old Testament of Bible. In my last two letters, I have quoted some verses from Old Testament. But you did not consider those verses. You just tell me whether those verses are true or false. If you declare them false, I do not have any say. But you must be bold enough to speak out what you believe.
Paulian Christian is based mainly on two assumptions:
1. Adam has committed sin; so, all his descendants are sinned by birth.
2. Jesus has died on cross to pay for the sins of all mankind who believes him.
But Bible speaks just opposite to it.
Ezekiel 18:20 The soul that sins is the soul that dies. The child does not share the guilt of the parent, nor the parent the guilt of the child
Jeremiah 31:30. It says- "Each person will pay for his own sin. You eat green apple, you are the one to get sick"
"(Deuteronomy 24:16) "The fathers shall not be put to death for the children, neither shall the children be put to death for the fathers: every man shall be put to death for his own sin."
"( 2 chronicles 7:14) God appeared to Solomon & said- "If my people, which are called by my name, shall humble themselves, and pray, and seek my face, and turn from their wicked ways; then will I hear from heaven, and will forgive their sin, and will heal their land."
Above four verses of Old Testament show that,
1. No man is sinned by birth
2. Child does not share the sin of parents
3. Nobody can pay for your sin, each person will pay for his own sin
4. God will forgive your sin if you pray to him. So, it is obvious that God doesn't need any sacrifice to forgive sins, so crucifixion makes no sense .
We see very clearly that the assumptions of Paulian Christianity on which it stands are not true & not supported by Bible. It is not supported by logic & justice as well.
At 12:50 PM 6/9/2012, you wrote:
Dear Khalilur,
In this email to me you wrote:
It is clear from your argument & logic that you people do not believein Old Testament of Bible.
My answer: That is silly. I have quoted to you MULITPLE times from the Old Testament and have answered you point by point everything you asked (and if I missed any, I apologize).
Now for your current email:
YOU WROTE:
You just tell me whether those verses are true or false. If you declare
them false, I do not have any say. But you must be bold enough to
speak out what you believe.
OK. I can be bold. You are wrong. In fact, it is again silly that you are trying to convince me that the Bible is NOT the Word of God, that it has been changed by man, by using the Bible itself. I guess I understand the strategy, if you can prove one part of my beliefs are not true, then the rest will fall like a house of cards. But, when my belief is based on the fact that the Bible itself is ENTIRELY the Word of God, then my house is built on a rock (as Jesus said). So you can attack any point and it doesn't weaken it, for it is whole and I bring nothing to it. I simply submit to it.
Because your following question also deals with this same issue, i will answer more fully below.
YOU WROTE:
I could not agree more! To do rightly, to love justice, to walk humbly with our God is the whole will of God for man.
So why do people reject His free gift? It is because the fear of God is not truly in them.
To fear God is to submit to what He says.
The problem with people is that they have rejected His Word. They accuse God, saying that He was unable to keep His book pure.
They deny the authority of scripture by doubting that Jesus was telling the truth when He said ' heaven and earth shall pass away, But MY words will by no means pass away." Mark 13:31
They deny the Father, for they reject the Son.
1Jo 2:23Whoever denies the Son does not have the Father either; he who acknowledges the Son has the Father also.
KHALILUR RAHMAN
It is clear from your argument & logic that you people do not believe in Old Testament of Bible. In my last two letters, I have quoted some verses from Old Testament. But you did not consider those verses. You just tell me whether those verses are true or false. If you declare them false, I do not have any say. But you must be bold enough to speak out what you believe.
Paulian Christian is based mainly on two assumptions:
1. Adam has committed sin; so, all his descendants are sinned by birth.
2. Jesus has died on cross to pay for the sins of all mankind who believes him.
But Bible speaks just opposite to it.
Ezekiel 18:20 The soul that sins is the soul that dies. The child does not share the guilt of the parent, nor the parent the guilt of the child
Jeremiah 31:30. It says- "Each person will pay for his own sin. You eat green apple, you are the one to get sick"
"(Deuteronomy 24:16) "The fathers shall not be put to death for the children, neither shall the children be put to death for the fathers: every man shall be put to death for his own sin."
"( 2 chronicles 7:14) God appeared to Solomon & said- "If my people, which are called by my name, shall humble themselves, and pray, and seek my face, and turn from their wicked ways; then will I hear from heaven, and will forgive their sin, and will heal their land."
Above four verses of Old Testament show that,
1. No man is sinned by birth
2. Child does not share the sin of parents
3. Nobody can pay for your sin, each person will pay for his own sin
4. God will forgive your sin if you pray to him. So, it is obvious that God doesn't need any sacrifice to forgive sins, so crucifixion makes no sense .
We see very clearly that the assumptions of Paulian Christianity on which it stands are not true & not supported by Bible. It is not supported by logic & justice as well.
At 12:50 PM 6/9/2012, you wrote:
Dear Khalilur,
In this email to me you wrote:
It is clear from your argument & logic that you people do not believein Old Testament of Bible.
My answer: That is silly. I have quoted to you MULITPLE times from the Old Testament and have answered you point by point everything you asked (and if I missed any, I apologize).
Now for your current email:
YOU WROTE:
You just tell me whether those verses are true or false. If you declare
them false, I do not have any say. But you must be bold enough to
speak out what you believe.
OK. I can be bold. You are wrong. In fact, it is again silly that you are trying to convince me that the Bible is NOT the Word of God, that it has been changed by man, by using the Bible itself. I guess I understand the strategy, if you can prove one part of my beliefs are not true, then the rest will fall like a house of cards. But, when my belief is based on the fact that the Bible itself is ENTIRELY the Word of God, then my house is built on a rock (as Jesus said). So you can attack any point and it doesn't weaken it, for it is whole and I bring nothing to it. I simply submit to it.
Because your following question also deals with this same issue, i will answer more fully below.
YOU WROTE:
Paulian Christian is based mainly on two assumptions:
1. Adam has committed sin; so, all his descendants are sinned by birth.
2. Jesus has died on cross to pay for the sins of all mankind who believes him.
But Bible speaks just opposite to it.
Ezekiel 18: 20 The soul that sins is the soul that dies. The child
does not share the guilt of the parent, nor the parent the guilt of the child
MY RESPONSE:
Ezekiel is writing to the people of Israel here. He is warning them exhorting them not to sin, because the soul that sins WILL die! He is making it clear to them that it is NOT because their fathers sinned that they are dying, it is because THEY sinned. He is strongly encouraging them to personal responsibility. He is NOT establishing some doctrine that eliminates the sin nature. The day that Adam and Eve ate of that tree, they indeed died (but not physically, but spiritually. Physical death was eventual, not immediate.) Their offspring were born in their image (not in the image of God)
And Adam lived one hundred and thirty years, and begot [a son] in his own likeness, after his image, and named him Seth (Genesis 5:3)
Seth was born in the image of Adam, therefore he died at age 912. The Bible does not say that Seth ever sinned. WHY DID HE DIE? It was because he was not born in the image of God (who is Eternal), but in the image of Adam, who was now doomed to die because of his sin, for all people sin because it is in their nature to do so.
Jeremiah 31: 30. It says- "Each person will pay for his own sin. You
eat green apple, you are the one to get sick"
MY RESPONSE: ( Please, listen to this scripture. The Context is what you need to see in order to understand the truth that God is teaching here)
Here is the CONTEXT of the Scripture you sent here:
""Behold, the days are coming, says the LORD, that I will sow the house of Israel and the house of Judah with the seed of man and the seed of beast." - (Jer 31:27 NKJV)
"In those days they shall say no more: 'The fathers have eaten sour grapes, And the children's teeth are set on edge.'" - (Jer 31:29 NKJV)
""But every one shall die for his own iniquity; every man who eats the sour grapes, his teeth shall be set on edge." - (Jer 31:30 NKJV)
""Behold, the days are coming, says the LORD, when I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel and with the house of Judah--" - (Jer 31:31 NKJV)
""not according to the covenant that I made with their fathers in the day that I took them by the hand to lead them out of the land of Egypt, My covenant which they broke, though I was a husband to them, says the LORD." - (Jer 31:32 NKJV)
""But this is the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel after those days, says the LORD: I will put My law in their minds, and write it on their hearts; and I will be their God, and they shall be My people." - (Jer 31:33 NKJV)
""No more shall every man teach his neighbor, and every man his brother, saying, 'Know the LORD,' for they all shall know Me, from the least of them to the greatest of them, says the LORD. For I will forgive their iniquity, and their sin I will remember no more."" - (Jer 31:34 NKJV)
So, two things here: One, just like above, the Lord is making it clear that we cannot blame OUR problems of death on our fathers. We all must take responsibility, for we have ALL sinned.
Secondly: The LORD states here that He is foretelling of a time to come as well as dealing with their need for individual responsibility now.
He is foretelling of a time to come (Vs. 31 "In those days they shall say no more"......). And the time to come will be very special. It is a time when He will " make a new covenant with the house of Israel and with the house of Judah".. (by the way, I believe, you said that God DID NOT say He was going to make a new covenant , well, here is a verse that says He would.)
YOU WROTE:
"(Deuteronomy 24: 16) "The fathers shall not be put to death for thechildren, neither shall the children be put to death for the fathers:every man shall be put to death for his own sin."
MY RESPONSE;
OK, let's look at the context for this verse: I just read the Chapter.... here's what it says:
The context here is that the Lord is instructing the people of Israel His laws and how the people should treat each other. So, one of the rules is that each person who does wrong should pay for their wrong doing themselves. This has nothing to do with Original Sin. It has to do with individual sin.
Now, before I go on to your next verse let me point out what the Bible DOES say about Original sin and how you can tell the concept is not "Pauline" but rather, Paul got his ideas from the Old Testament.
Pslam 51: 5 Behold, I was brought forth in iniquity, And in sin my mother conceived me. [If children are born without sin, how is it the David was 'brought forth in iniquity and in sin my mother conceived me'?]
Ps.58:3: "the wicked go astray from the womb, they err from their birth speaking lies.[Again, not innocent from birth].
Job, often said to be the oldest book in the Bible says: Job 25:4: "How then can man be righteous before God? Or how can he be pure who is born of a woman?"
What do you think about his? Does the evidence bear out that mankind is sinful through and through, or that we have the tendency to purity and holiness?
One last verse: When Adam and Eve sinned God CURSED the earth and the animals, the serpent, the man and the woman. That pretty much includes everyone and everything. The proof of that is that EVERYONE THAT IS BORN.....DIES!
YOU WROTE:
"( 2 chronicles 7: 14) God appeared to Solomon & said- "If my
people, which are called by my name, shall humble themselves, and
pray, and seek my face, and turn from their wicked ways; then will I
hear from heaven, and will forgive their sin, and will heal their land."
MY REPONSE:
Yes indeed, this verse is true....for the people of the Nation of Israel (and at the time of the prophecy specifically.) For they lived in Covenant with God, AS A NATION. Yes, there were promises made to individuals, but overall the covenant was made to the people as a whole, as born out in what we saw above about the New Covenant that God was going to make (and since has).
YOU WROTE:
Above four verses of Old Testament show that,
1. No man is sinned by birth.............. (I believe I have shown that people ARE born with a sin nature)
2. Child does not share the sin of parents (REPEAT above)
3. Nobody can pay for your sin, each person will pay for his own sin (Look at all of the Old testament SIN sacrifices offered to the Lord. Over and over again to cover the peoples sins.)
4. God will forgive your sin if you pray to him. So, it is obviousthat God doesn't need any sacrifice to forgive sins, so crucifixionmakes no sense .(OK, let's look at a few more verses here to help you see what the Bible say about the need for sacrifices, named the sacrifice of Jesus on the cross) :
Here's just a few of the many:
"And he shall burn all his fat upon the altar, as the fat of the sacrifice of peace offerings: and the priest shall make an atonement for him as concerning his sin, and it shall be forgiven him." - (Lev 4:26 KJV)
"And he shall take away all the fat thereof, as the fat of the lamb is taken away from the sacrifice of the peace offerings; and the priest shall burn them upon the altar, according to the offerings made by fire unto the LORD: and the priest shall make an atonement for his sin that he hath committed, and it shall be forgiven him." - (Lev 4:35 KJV)
"This is the law of the burnt offering, of the meat offering, and of the sin offering, and of the trespass offering, and of the consecrations, and of the sacrifice of the peace offerings;" - (Lev 7:37 KJV)
"And the priest shall make an atonement for all the congregation of the children of Israel, and it shall be forgiven them; for it is ignorance: and they shall bring their offering, a sacrifice made by fire unto the LORD, and their sin offering before the LORD, for their ignorance:" - (Num 15:25 KJV)
And finally:
YOU WROTE:
We see very clearly that the assumptions of Paulian Christianity onwhich it stands are not true & not supported by Bible. It is notsupported by logic & justice as well.
MY RESPONSE:
I believe I have carefully answered each of your criticisms point by point and shown that it is YOUR point of view that isthe one that is un-biblical, therefore it is ill-logical and unjustified.
KHALILUR RAHMAN
I am sorry to say ,Your argument is so funny & ridiculous that it is beyond any common sense also. Seth died not for his sin, but it is natural to die. Qur'an says- All living animals will have the taste of death. Everybody will die whether you commit sin or not. John did not commit any sin, but he died. Even you have made Jesus to die, although we believe that Jesus did not die on cross, he will come back & will die a natural death. You claim yourself to be an innocent man, but you will die, your parents & children will die. You said, we die because we are made in the image of Adam. Ridiculous. Even if something is not made in the image of Adam, it will die. Your dog will die, your donkey will die. Do you think they are made in the image of Adam?
If Adam is made in the image of God, and we are made in the image of Adam, then it becomes obvious that we also carry the image of God. But what you mean by image of God? Does it mean we look like God? Does it mean that God also have hands, feet, head & eyes like us? No, it is not like that. Genesis 1:27 says- " He created them Godlike, reflecting God's nature." It means that we are also having all the qualities & representative power of God , so that we can take charge & be responsible for fish in the sea, and birds in the air, for every living things that move on the face of earth ( Gen 1:28).
God has put good spirit & bad spirit in every man ( In Islam, it is called Taqwa&Fujura). If you are under the influence of good spirit, you will do righteous deeds. But if you are under the influence of bad spirit, you will commit sin. A man is free to choose his deeds.
You quoted from Job 25:4: "How then can man be righteous before God? Or how can he be pure who is born of a woman?" I did not find anything like this in my Bible. However, it is not said by God. It is mere an experience of Job. If you take it as TRUE, then Jesus is also not a pure man because he is born of a woman.
You have quoted from Exodus. " visiting the iniquity of the fathers upon the children and the children's children to the third and the fourth generation."" - (Exd 34: 7 NKJV)"" This is the punishment given by God to the people of Moses when they disobey God & did not enter the city designated by God. This punishment was valid up to 4th generations & then withdrawn. Please note that iniquity visited from fathers to children, not sin. You must know the difference between Iniquity & Sin.
As I told before, God will forgive you if you pray to him & come back from wickedness. God does not need any sacrifice for your sin. Please note this verse from Samuel. (1sam 15:22) "And Samuel said, Hath the LORD as great delight in burnt offerings and sacrifices, as in obeying the voice of the LORD? Behold, to obey is better than sacrifice, and to hearken than the fat of rams."
I did not say that God will not send any new Covenant. I said where is that new covenant? This New Covenant is none but the Covenant of Islam which has come for whole mankind and which will remain valid till the doom's day. Jesus will come back & will follow this New Covenant of Islam.
At 12:23 PM 6/10/2012,
connect@godlife.com wrote:
Dear Khalilur,
Please, allow me to clarify what I meant.
Adam was made from the dust of the earth. He was made in the image of God. Eve was taken from his side.
They were told not to eat of the tree in the midst of the garden and if they did, they would die.
They did eat of it. They died, but not physically, but rather, spiritually.
By yielding themselves to Lucifer, they lost the glory of God. God is life and to lose His glory is death.
The children of Adam and Eve are born without the glory of God.
They are spiritually dead.
That's why Jesus says "you MUST be born again in order to enter the kingdom of God".
This is also why John the disciple says that you must be born of water and spirit to see the kingdom of God.
This is what I meant when I said we are born with original sin.
Jesus was born of woman, but also of the seed of God, so He was born without sin, although He was born in a physical body by way of Mary, daughter of Eve.
The Bible declares that the entire world was also subject to death because of man's sin. The Bible declares that all the world groans in waiting for the revelation of the son of God.
I know my beliefs seem foolish to you. That's because I believe the Bible is the Word of God.
You do not.
So, now back to what you said about God speaking to Moses, that it was in reference to them not going into the Promised Land. Not so. This particular appearance of God was before they turned back in unbelief. This was when God appeared to Moses and gave Him the law, so the declaration of God that He visits the sins on the 3rd and 4th generations had nothing to do with what you say.
So, tell me, what does Islam offer me? What I mean by that, what is there in the way you live that makes you more close to God than I? What does your religion offer me in order to be accepted by God that I am not already doing?
I pray. I seek God every day. I work diligently to never sin and when I do sin, I turn back to Him immediately and ask forgiveness. I read the Bible every day. I love my neighbors; I forgive my enemies (pretty much). I try to live Holy as He is Holy. I teach people about God. I don't steal or cheat people. I give to the poor. I live a humble life. I spend hours of every day writing to you and others on the internet.
I work hard every day, up to 12 hours a day! I always seek to be pleasing in the sight of God.
So, again, what am I missing? Are there certain rules that I need to keep to go to heaven that I am not keeping?
Dear Khalilur,
Please, allow me to clarify what I meant.
Adam was made from the dust of the earth. He was made in the image of God. Eve was taken from his side.
They were told not to eat of the tree in the midst of the garden and if they did, they would die.
They did eat of it. They died, but not physically, but rather, spiritually.
By yielding themselves to Lucifer, they lost the glory of God. God is life and to lose His glory is death.
The children of Adam and Eve are born without the glory of God.
They are spiritually dead.
That's why Jesus says "you MUST be born again in order to enter the kingdom of God".
This is also why John the disciple says that you must be born of water and spirit to see the kingdom of God.
This is what I meant when I said we are born with original sin.
Jesus was born of woman, but also of the seed of God, so He was born without sin, although He was born in a physical body by way of Mary, daughter of Eve.
The Bible declares that the entire world was also subject to death because of man's sin. The Bible declares that all the world groans in waiting for the revelation of the son of God.
I know my beliefs seem foolish to you. That's because I believe the Bible is the Word of God.
You do not.
So, now back to what you said about God speaking to Moses, that it was in reference to them not going into the Promised Land. Not so. This particular appearance of God was before they turned back in unbelief. This was when God appeared to Moses and gave Him the law, so the declaration of God that He visits the sins on the 3rd and 4th generations had nothing to do with what you say.
So, tell me, what does Islam offer me? What I mean by that, what is there in the way you live that makes you more close to God than I? What does your religion offer me in order to be accepted by God that I am not already doing?
I pray. I seek God every day. I work diligently to never sin and when I do sin, I turn back to Him immediately and ask forgiveness. I read the Bible every day. I love my neighbors; I forgive my enemies (pretty much). I try to live Holy as He is Holy. I teach people about God. I don't steal or cheat people. I give to the poor. I live a humble life. I spend hours of every day writing to you and others on the internet.
I work hard every day, up to 12 hours a day! I always seek to be pleasing in the sight of God.
So, again, what am I missing? Are there certain rules that I need to keep to go to heaven that I am not keeping?
KHALILUR RAHMAN
I am happy that you have given a description of your daily activities
"I pray. I seek God every day. I work diligently to never sin and when I do sin, I turn back to Him immediately and ask forgiveness. I read the Bible every day. I love my neighbors; I forgive my enemies (pretty much). I try to live Holy as He is Holy. I teach people about God. I don't steal or cheat people. I give to the poor. I live a humble life. I spend hours of every day writing to you and others on the internet. I work hard every day, up to 12 hours a day! I always seek to be pleasing in the sight of God."
This is a picture of a very pious man. But just one question. You pray to whom? If you pray to God, you are nothing but a Muslim & there is hardly any difference between us.. If you pray to Jesus, it is a blasphemy & your all righteous deeds will be washed away. Read the following verses from Bible.
Gen 34: 16-18 Do not worship any other God. God his name The-Jealous-One.
Mathew 4:10 - Worship the Lord your God, and only him. Serve him with absolute single-heartedness.
Mathew 7:7 -" Don't bargain with God. Be direct. Ask for what you need, you will be given."
So, it is clear from Bible that you have
to pray to God only, not to Jesus.
Now, can you please explain about the following characters given in Revelation: 1. The Beast coming out of sea (Rev 13:1) 2. The Dragon 3. The Lamb 4. Anti-Christ 5. A man on a white horse with a bow ( Rev 6:2) 6. A man on a white horse with name Faithful & Truth (Rev 19:11)
At 09:49 AM 6/11/2012, you wrote:
Dear Khalilur,
I will answer your questions in the next email.
I just wanted to send you this scripture first, which refutes what you say about sin and sacrifice.
You say that no one can pay for the sins of others. I say you are wrong and that my belief is basedon what the Bible says, and it's not just something people made up.
"Yet it pleased the LORD to bruise Him; He has put Him to grief. When You make His soul an offering for sin, He shall see His seed, He shall prolong His days, And the pleasure of the LORD shall prosper in His hand." - (Isa 53:10 NKJV)
"He shall see the labor of His soul, and be satisfied. By His knowledge My righteous Servant shall justify many, For He shall bear their iniquities." - (Isa 53:11 NKJV)
This is a prophecy from Isaiah about Jesus, the suffering servant. As you can see, God definitely planned for Jesus to come to earth to die for the sins of the world.
You don't have to be a Christian to be Muslim, that is, it's not about a name or religion. It's about truly submitting to God. Submitting to God means accepting what He says as true, it means obeying what He says, it means yielding control of our lives to His rulership. He is the King. He is the Lord. He is God.
Now, can you please explain about the following characters given in Revelation: 1. The Beast coming out of sea (Rev 13:1) 2. The Dragon 3. The Lamb 4. Anti-Christ 5. A man on a white horse with a bow ( Rev 6:2) 6. A man on a white horse with name Faithful & Truth (Rev 19:11)
At 09:49 AM 6/11/2012, you wrote:
Dear Khalilur,
I will answer your questions in the next email.
I just wanted to send you this scripture first, which refutes what you say about sin and sacrifice.
You say that no one can pay for the sins of others. I say you are wrong and that my belief is basedon what the Bible says, and it's not just something people made up.
"Yet it pleased the LORD to bruise Him; He has put Him to grief. When You make His soul an offering for sin, He shall see His seed, He shall prolong His days, And the pleasure of the LORD shall prosper in His hand." - (Isa 53:10 NKJV)
"He shall see the labor of His soul, and be satisfied. By His knowledge My righteous Servant shall justify many, For He shall bear their iniquities." - (Isa 53:11 NKJV)
This is a prophecy from Isaiah about Jesus, the suffering servant. As you can see, God definitely planned for Jesus to come to earth to die for the sins of the world.
You don't have to be a Christian to be Muslim, that is, it's not about a name or religion. It's about truly submitting to God. Submitting to God means accepting what He says as true, it means obeying what He says, it means yielding control of our lives to His rulership. He is the King. He is the Lord. He is God.
KHALILUR RAHMAN
I liked what you said in this mail.
I liked what you said in this mail.
"You don't have to be a
Christian to be Muslim, that is, it's not about a name or religion. It's about
truly submitting to God. Submitting to God means accepting what He says as
true, it means obeying what He says, it means yielding control of our lives to
His ruler ship. He is the King. He is the Lord. He is God."
I agree 100% with you. But we have to find out what God exactly said. When there is confusion, when there is a contradiction, we have to filter out which is God's word & which is not. I have quoted what God said to Moses, Solomon & other prophets. But you are trying to counter it by visions seen by Isaiah. God's word & vision by somebody is not comparable. Moreover, it is not clear that they are talking about Jesus. It is not mentioned that he was killed on cross. These visions may fit to many prophets including John.
In fact Jesus did not indicate anywhere that he is going to die to pay for other's sin. Rather, he prayed to God to remove this cup of death from him. He said in Mark 14:35 - "Going a little ahead, he prostrated on the ground & said, Father, Father , you can do everything. Take this cup away from me". When he was going to become senseless on cross, he shouted-" Eloi, Eloi, lama sabakthani. which means, My God my God, why you have abandoned me ( Mark 15:34)." If Jesus knew that he is going to die to pay for the sin of mankind, he would not have complained to God like this. He would have accepted this death very sportingly. Here it is clear that he was put to cross against his will.
In fact Jesus did not die on cross. He was senseless. Weather was becoming adverse. The soldiers thought that he was dead. They did not break his leg. They handed over the body to Josef for burial & quickly returned to their houses. Josef buried him in a big & wide cave-like grave in the presence of Mary & Mary Magdalena. Mary & Mary Magdalena did understand that Jesus did not die. They treated him with ointment. Sunday morning, Mary Magdalena , along with other women, took ointment with them & went to the grave. They found the grave opened wide & Jesus had gone. They were afraid of Jews getting Jesus again. When they found Jesus in the garden, they were delighted. When Jesus met his disciples, they thought, it is the spirit of Jesus. Jesus confirmed them that he is not spirit. He is still alive. He took fish & honey to prove that he is not a spirit because a spirit does not eat & drink. And finally Jesus was taken up in the sky alive.
If you read the Gospel very analytically, you will find this fact.
I agree 100% with you. But we have to find out what God exactly said. When there is confusion, when there is a contradiction, we have to filter out which is God's word & which is not. I have quoted what God said to Moses, Solomon & other prophets. But you are trying to counter it by visions seen by Isaiah. God's word & vision by somebody is not comparable. Moreover, it is not clear that they are talking about Jesus. It is not mentioned that he was killed on cross. These visions may fit to many prophets including John.
In fact Jesus did not indicate anywhere that he is going to die to pay for other's sin. Rather, he prayed to God to remove this cup of death from him. He said in Mark 14:35 - "Going a little ahead, he prostrated on the ground & said, Father, Father , you can do everything. Take this cup away from me". When he was going to become senseless on cross, he shouted-" Eloi, Eloi, lama sabakthani. which means, My God my God, why you have abandoned me ( Mark 15:34)." If Jesus knew that he is going to die to pay for the sin of mankind, he would not have complained to God like this. He would have accepted this death very sportingly. Here it is clear that he was put to cross against his will.
In fact Jesus did not die on cross. He was senseless. Weather was becoming adverse. The soldiers thought that he was dead. They did not break his leg. They handed over the body to Josef for burial & quickly returned to their houses. Josef buried him in a big & wide cave-like grave in the presence of Mary & Mary Magdalena. Mary & Mary Magdalena did understand that Jesus did not die. They treated him with ointment. Sunday morning, Mary Magdalena , along with other women, took ointment with them & went to the grave. They found the grave opened wide & Jesus had gone. They were afraid of Jews getting Jesus again. When they found Jesus in the garden, they were delighted. When Jesus met his disciples, they thought, it is the spirit of Jesus. Jesus confirmed them that he is not spirit. He is still alive. He took fish & honey to prove that he is not a spirit because a spirit does not eat & drink. And finally Jesus was taken up in the sky alive.
If you read the Gospel very analytically, you will find this fact.
At 11:21 AM 6/11/2012,
connect@godlife.com wrote:
Dear Khalilur,
I am writing here to answer your questions now:
Gen 34: 16-18 Do not worship any other God. God his name The-Jealous-One.
Amen! I do not worship any other God. I only worship the One who created all things.
Colossiians 2:9 For in Him dwells all the fullness of the Godhead bodily.
Dear Khalilur,
I am writing here to answer your questions now:
Gen 34: 16-18 Do not worship any other God. God his name The-Jealous-One.
Amen! I do not worship any other God. I only worship the One who created all things.
Colossiians 2:9 For in Him dwells all the fullness of the Godhead bodily.
Mathew 4: 10 - Worship the Lord your God, and only him. Serve him
with absolute single-heartedness.
Amen! John 14:1 "Let not your heart be troubled; you believe in God, believe also in Me."
John20: 27-31 Jesus is speaking:
"Then He said to Thomas, "Reach your finger here, and look at My hands; and reach your hand here, and put it into My side. Do not be unbelieving, but believing. And Thomas answered and said to Him, "My Lord and my God!" Jesus said to him, "Thomas, because you have seen Me, you have believed. Blessed are those who have not seen and yet have believed." And truly Jesus did many other signs in the presence of His disciples, which are not written in this book; but these are written that you may believe that Jesus is the Christ, the Son of God, and that believing you may have life in His name."
Jesus did not rebuke Thomas for bowing and worshipping, not for calling Him God. Why not?
Mathew 7: 7 -" Don't bargain with God. Be direct. Ask for what you
need, you will be given."
I don't know what Bible you're looking in, but is is inaccurate, this verse actually says: "Ask, and it will be given to you; seek, and you will find; knock, and it will be opened to you.
But either way, what does this have to do with Jesus being God?
Can you please explain about the following characters given in
Revelation: 1. The Beast coming out of sea (Rev 13:1)
As I understand it, this is an extension of Daniels prophecy in 7:7, about the extension of the Roman empire, which isstill to come, from which the one world ruler will come. The great deceiver whom the world will follow as the Messiah, but who in fact is a deceiver and will many people astray. (I believe this guy is about to show up in the world and will bring world peace.)
2. The Dragon. In the Bible, Jesus refers to Lucifer, Satan as 'The Dragon'. The Dragon is used to refer to Satan.
3. The Lamb: If you're speaking of the Lamb of God who comes to take away the sin of the world (as proclaimed by John the Baptist (John 1: 29), then you're talking about Jesus.
4. Anti-Christ : The Spirit of Anti-Christ is spoken of by John in his letters (not his gospel). He says this about it:
"Little children, it is the last hour; and as you have heard that the Antichrist is coming, even now many antichrists have come, by which we know that it is the last hour." - (1Jo 2:18 NKJV)
"Who is a liar but he who denies that Jesus is the Christ? He is antichrist who denies the Father and the Son." - (1Jo 2:22 NKJV)
"and every spirit that does not confess that Jesus Christ has come in the flesh is not of God. And this is the spirit of the Antichrist, which you have heard was coming, and is now already in the world." - (1Jo 4:3 NKJV)
"For many deceivers have gone out into the world who do not confess Jesus Christ as coming in the flesh. This is a deceiver and an antichrist." - (2Jo 1:7 NKJV)
So, basically, the spirit of anti-Christ is the devil, and he goes about denying that Jesus is the Son of God and that God came in the flesh!
5. A man on a white horse with a bow ( Rev 6: 2) I believe this speaks of the coming world ruler (or the person John refers to in verse 18 of 1John as THE Antichrist. I'm not 100% sure on this one, but it appears that is who this verse refers to by what he does and what comes after him. It appears the Antichrist appears at the beginning of the great tribulation, he comes out 'conquering and to conquer', so basically, he takes over the world. OR, it could be an Angel, just like the other horse riders revealed in this passage.
6. A man on a white horse with name Faithful &Truth
(Rev 19: 11) This is the Word of God. This is Jesus, the Lion of the Tribe of Judah. This is the judge of the whole earth. He is the KING OF KINGS AND LORD OF LORDS ( Rev. 19:16).
This is the day of the great battle of Armageddon, when the people of the world, the followers of Lucifer, come out to make war against Jesus and His followers.
I want to ask few more questions on Revelation.
1. Which are the areas where this great battle of Armageddon will be fought?
2. Do you think the Jews will fight against Jesus?
3. In Revelation, is there any prediction about rising of Islam & spreading it from East to West?
At 08:46 AM 6/13/2012, connect@godlife.com wrote:
Dear
Khalilur,
Revelation information:
1. Which are the areas where this great battle of Armageddon will be fought? I am uncertain. I have heard that it would be in the Valley of Megiddo, but there is some question to that. It's also not clear when it will occur. For it is not just nations coming against Israel, but it is Satan's forces coming against the Christ of God, so this war really is none of my concern. Mine is to trust and obey Him, His is the glory and honor.
2. Do you think the Jews will fight against Jesus? During the Battle of Armageddon the forces of Satan will come and try to defeat Christ, so whether they beJew or Greek, if they are followers of Satan, yes, they will fight against Jesus. (They already do, spiritually.)
3. In Revelation, is there any prediction about rising of Islam &
spreading it from East to West? I do not know of a prediction about rising of Islam in Revelation, but I have heard a Bible teacher who used to follow the Quar'an who believes that the 'mark of the beast' written of by John in Revelation is not the number 666 as many people say, but instead is actually something written in Arabic, right inside of the original Bible (the codex vaticanus). He said that when he was reading the original manuscripts it jumped out at him. He believes that when John said ' this is the number of his name', John was simply copying what he say and did not understand, which was a phrase written in Arabic which says something like "The Army of Allah".
Revelation information:
1. Which are the areas where this great battle of Armageddon will be fought? I am uncertain. I have heard that it would be in the Valley of Megiddo, but there is some question to that. It's also not clear when it will occur. For it is not just nations coming against Israel, but it is Satan's forces coming against the Christ of God, so this war really is none of my concern. Mine is to trust and obey Him, His is the glory and honor.
2. Do you think the Jews will fight against Jesus? During the Battle of Armageddon the forces of Satan will come and try to defeat Christ, so whether they beJew or Greek, if they are followers of Satan, yes, they will fight against Jesus. (They already do, spiritually.)
3. In Revelation, is there any prediction about rising of Islam &
spreading it from East to West? I do not know of a prediction about rising of Islam in Revelation, but I have heard a Bible teacher who used to follow the Quar'an who believes that the 'mark of the beast' written of by John in Revelation is not the number 666 as many people say, but instead is actually something written in Arabic, right inside of the original Bible (the codex vaticanus). He said that when he was reading the original manuscripts it jumped out at him. He believes that when John said ' this is the number of his name', John was simply copying what he say and did not understand, which was a phrase written in Arabic which says something like "The Army of Allah".
KHALILUR
RAHMAN
Now I have
understood how the mis-interpretation of Revelation of Bible can lead the whole
nations of Christianity into an unjust war in Middle East. Whatever you have
sent to me is totally wrong. But unfortunately, the Christian world is taking
action in Middle East based on the wrong interpretation of Revelation. They are
thinking that they are creating a suitable field in Middle East where Jesus can
land safely. But their concept is wrong as usual.
Let us study & discuss the Revelation with wisdom & open mind. Please note, revelation demands wisdom. Without wisdom, you cannot get a correct picture.
There are some established facts in Bible & Revelation. Firstly, We must agree to those facts .They are as below:
1. The war of Armageddon will be fought in Middle Eastern Area. There is no doubt about it. Jesus is seen on the mount of Zion with his followers. This mount is around Jerusalem, may be in Syria. Islam also says that Jesus will land on a tower of a mosque in Damascus & he will wait on a mount with his followers.
2. All Jews are anti-Christ. They were against Jesus during his life time, they will also fight Jesus at his 2nd coming. Bible says, Sons of Jacob will be mostly persecuted during this war. Two third of them will be killed in this war. The remaining one third will accept Jesus after this war. So, there is no doubt that all Jews are anti-Christ.
3. Beast & Dragon ( Serpent) are also Anti-Christ. Jesus will fight them & killed their followers. And they will be thrown in the lake of fire.
Now please tell me , do you agree to the above assumptions in the light of Bible & Revelation? We proceed further after your response.
At 08:59 AM 6/13/2012, connect@godlife.com wrote:
Let us study & discuss the Revelation with wisdom & open mind. Please note, revelation demands wisdom. Without wisdom, you cannot get a correct picture.
There are some established facts in Bible & Revelation. Firstly, We must agree to those facts .They are as below:
1. The war of Armageddon will be fought in Middle Eastern Area. There is no doubt about it. Jesus is seen on the mount of Zion with his followers. This mount is around Jerusalem, may be in Syria. Islam also says that Jesus will land on a tower of a mosque in Damascus & he will wait on a mount with his followers.
2. All Jews are anti-Christ. They were against Jesus during his life time, they will also fight Jesus at his 2nd coming. Bible says, Sons of Jacob will be mostly persecuted during this war. Two third of them will be killed in this war. The remaining one third will accept Jesus after this war. So, there is no doubt that all Jews are anti-Christ.
3. Beast & Dragon ( Serpent) are also Anti-Christ. Jesus will fight them & killed their followers. And they will be thrown in the lake of fire.
Now please tell me , do you agree to the above assumptions in the light of Bible & Revelation? We proceed further after your response.
At 08:59 AM 6/13/2012, connect@godlife.com wrote:
Dear
Khalilur,
Jesus did indeed say He was going to die for our sins!
Here it is written in Matthew: "And as they were eating, Jesus took bread, blessed and broke it, and gave it to the disciples and said, "Take, eat; this is My body."" - (Mat 26:26 NKJV)
"Then He took the cup, and gave thanks, and gave it to them, saying, "Drink from it, all of you." - (Mat 26:27 NKJV)
""For this is My blood of the new covenant, which is shed for many for the remission of sins." - (Mat 26:28 NKJV)
So, I ask you. Why do you not believe that God sent His Son to die to pay for your sins, when He said exactly that, right here?
The rest of what you say about His crucifixion is simply not true. I do, as you say, read the bible analytically and it CLEARLY shows Christ and Him crucified.
KHALILUR RAHMAN
These are all symbolic expressions which you people always do misinterpret. Now tell me, do you really eat flesh & blood of Jesus? It is not practically possible. It means you take Jesus in your life whole-heartedly. That will remit your sin.. Jesus said-" if you love me, follow my all orders ( John 14:15)..
As I told you in my last mail, Jesus DID NOT DIE ON CROSS. He was senseless, but the soldiers thought he was dead. He was given treatment in his grave. When he appeared before his disciples, he never said that I was dead & now I am alive. Rather he was trying to prove that he is still with this earthly body & yet to go to God above.
Previously, Jesus used to tell his disciples-" Let me go, let me go to my Father, If I do not go I cannot send the Comforter for you." He never said-" Let me die, let me die..... ...".
When people was asking signs from him, he said in Mathew 12:39-40 “Jesus Said Unfaithful & wicked people ask for sign. I will not give them any sign, except the sign of Jonah. Jonah was in the belly of fish for 3 nights & 3 days. So, the son of man will remain in the belly of earth for 3 days & 3 nights”. Jesus said he will remain in the belly of earth like Jonah was in the belly of fish. Please note here, Jonah was alive in the belly of fish. So, Jesus, the son of man was also remained alive in the belly of earth to fulfill his sign.
At 10:46 AM 6/14/2012, connect@godlife.com wrote:
Dear Khalilur,
You make the assumption that the United States leaders are preparing the way for Jesus to land. The reason that's nonsense is that most of them do not even believe the Bible is the Word of God and IF they did, Jesus NEVER said to do that.
In fact, He said the OPPOSITE!
He said 'if my kingdom was of this world, My disciples would fight'. Jesus Kingdom in Heaven and His disciples' calling is to lay down their lives that others might be saved, just as He did (not literally, necessarily, but definitely figuratively .....and sometimes physically).
Yes, Jesus will land on the Mt. of Olives, it will split in 2. He will throw the Beast and the Prophet into the Lake of Fire. The specifics are not that important, as it's not like anyone is going to not know what's happening when it does. I just pray you come to Him now, in the day of Salvation.
Your focus on Jews being Anti-Christ tells me that you do not love Jews. I love Jews. I love Muslims. If I didn't love anti-Christ people, I would not be Godly. God loves anti-Christ people. He came to save them!
I don't think there's much reason to continue this back and forth discussion since you clearly reject anything I show you in the Bible, but if you want, we can continue.
I will send this reply and my reply to 'fear of God' thread that we have going. I have already written that one, but I wanted to be able to read this email to see what it said before I sent the other.
Jesus did indeed say He was going to die for our sins!
Here it is written in Matthew: "And as they were eating, Jesus took bread, blessed and broke it, and gave it to the disciples and said, "Take, eat; this is My body."" - (Mat 26:26 NKJV)
"Then He took the cup, and gave thanks, and gave it to them, saying, "Drink from it, all of you." - (Mat 26:27 NKJV)
""For this is My blood of the new covenant, which is shed for many for the remission of sins." - (Mat 26:28 NKJV)
So, I ask you. Why do you not believe that God sent His Son to die to pay for your sins, when He said exactly that, right here?
The rest of what you say about His crucifixion is simply not true. I do, as you say, read the bible analytically and it CLEARLY shows Christ and Him crucified.
KHALILUR RAHMAN
These are all symbolic expressions which you people always do misinterpret. Now tell me, do you really eat flesh & blood of Jesus? It is not practically possible. It means you take Jesus in your life whole-heartedly. That will remit your sin.. Jesus said-" if you love me, follow my all orders ( John 14:15)..
As I told you in my last mail, Jesus DID NOT DIE ON CROSS. He was senseless, but the soldiers thought he was dead. He was given treatment in his grave. When he appeared before his disciples, he never said that I was dead & now I am alive. Rather he was trying to prove that he is still with this earthly body & yet to go to God above.
Previously, Jesus used to tell his disciples-" Let me go, let me go to my Father, If I do not go I cannot send the Comforter for you." He never said-" Let me die, let me die..... ...".
When people was asking signs from him, he said in Mathew 12:39-40 “Jesus Said Unfaithful & wicked people ask for sign. I will not give them any sign, except the sign of Jonah. Jonah was in the belly of fish for 3 nights & 3 days. So, the son of man will remain in the belly of earth for 3 days & 3 nights”. Jesus said he will remain in the belly of earth like Jonah was in the belly of fish. Please note here, Jonah was alive in the belly of fish. So, Jesus, the son of man was also remained alive in the belly of earth to fulfill his sign.
At 10:46 AM 6/14/2012, connect@godlife.com wrote:
Dear Khalilur,
You make the assumption that the United States leaders are preparing the way for Jesus to land. The reason that's nonsense is that most of them do not even believe the Bible is the Word of God and IF they did, Jesus NEVER said to do that.
In fact, He said the OPPOSITE!
He said 'if my kingdom was of this world, My disciples would fight'. Jesus Kingdom in Heaven and His disciples' calling is to lay down their lives that others might be saved, just as He did (not literally, necessarily, but definitely figuratively .....and sometimes physically).
Yes, Jesus will land on the Mt. of Olives, it will split in 2. He will throw the Beast and the Prophet into the Lake of Fire. The specifics are not that important, as it's not like anyone is going to not know what's happening when it does. I just pray you come to Him now, in the day of Salvation.
Your focus on Jews being Anti-Christ tells me that you do not love Jews. I love Jews. I love Muslims. If I didn't love anti-Christ people, I would not be Godly. God loves anti-Christ people. He came to save them!
I don't think there's much reason to continue this back and forth discussion since you clearly reject anything I show you in the Bible, but if you want, we can continue.
I will send this reply and my reply to 'fear of God' thread that we have going. I have already written that one, but I wanted to be able to read this email to see what it said before I sent the other.
KHALILUR
RAHMAN
Whether you love Muslims or Jews, it
does not change the status of Muslim or Jews. You already know Muslim's status
regarding Jesus. You also know that Jews does not believe anything regarding
Jesus. They also do not believe in his miraculous birth. Bible says they will
fight Jesus , but two third of them will perish in the war of Armageddon.
Remaining one third of them will accept Jesus after this war. Keeping these in
view, I asked you specifically whether you believe that the Jews are
anti-Christ. Unless we clarify this question, we will not understand many predictions
in Revelation. Please be honest & reply.
At 10:49 AM 6/14/2012, you wrote:
Dear Khalilur,
In reading your reply, it is obvious that you have chosen not to admit what is right in front of you, plainly shown in the Bible.
You hop, skip and dance around clearly delineated passages in order to make them fit the narrative given you by your teachers.
I understand your quandary. If you acknowledge that the Bible clearly shows that Jesus died for our sins and rose again on the 3rd day, you would have to reexamine your faith in the teachings of Mohammed and the Qur’an, which you cannot do, for to do so is to abandon your faith and face certain hell fire (per your religions teachings.)
I can only tell you this. God loves you , not because you are a good and pious man, but because it is His nature to do so.
God is good and beautiful. His mercy is new every morning and His grace is sufficient to meet your every need.
Please be reconciled to Him. Jesus died to make that way for you. He takes no pleasure in the destruction of the wicked. But He cannot save those who reject Him, for to do so would violate His nature as well. For He made you in His image and granted you with a mind and a will to choose or reject Him.
I have done my best to show you Jesus, I only wish I was better at it and that I could have seen you accept the free Gift of eternal life.
At 10:49 AM 6/14/2012, you wrote:
Dear Khalilur,
In reading your reply, it is obvious that you have chosen not to admit what is right in front of you, plainly shown in the Bible.
You hop, skip and dance around clearly delineated passages in order to make them fit the narrative given you by your teachers.
I understand your quandary. If you acknowledge that the Bible clearly shows that Jesus died for our sins and rose again on the 3rd day, you would have to reexamine your faith in the teachings of Mohammed and the Qur’an, which you cannot do, for to do so is to abandon your faith and face certain hell fire (per your religions teachings.)
I can only tell you this. God loves you , not because you are a good and pious man, but because it is His nature to do so.
God is good and beautiful. His mercy is new every morning and His grace is sufficient to meet your every need.
Please be reconciled to Him. Jesus died to make that way for you. He takes no pleasure in the destruction of the wicked. But He cannot save those who reject Him, for to do so would violate His nature as well. For He made you in His image and granted you with a mind and a will to choose or reject Him.
I have done my best to show you Jesus, I only wish I was better at it and that I could have seen you accept the free Gift of eternal life.
KHALILUR RAHMAN
I have quoted from your Gospel &
tried to show that Jesus did not die on cross. Certainly Qur'an also say so
& nowhere it is mentioned in Old Testament or Jesus said himself that he
will die on cross. Whatever I quoted from your Bible also support my
statement. If you do not agree to my explanation or if you have any other
explanations, please say so. But you
have not touched at all about my quotes.
If you want we can close this chapter & continue our discussions on Revelation only. But I want to ask you a private question. Do you see God or talk to God? If yes, how it happens, because I do not have any experience like that.
If you want we can close this chapter & continue our discussions on Revelation only. But I want to ask you a private question. Do you see God or talk to God? If yes, how it happens, because I do not have any experience like that.
At 08:24
AM 6/15/2012, connect@godlife.com wrote:
Dear Khalilur,
Once again I will respond as I did to the last time you asked if the Jews were anti-Christ.........
EVERYONE who rejects Christ is of the Spirit of anti-Christ.
This include you.
YOU have told me that Jesus is NOT the Christ! Do you realize that you said this?
KHALILUR RAHMAN
Your reply is again as confusing as your Gospel. You did not give any direct reply about Jews. I think you are afraid of admitting that the Jews are Anti-Christ because it may go against your interest or against the interest of Christian nations. However, it is absolutely true that the Jews are anti-Christ. Anybody have doubt on it, they have doubt on their own Bible.
Qur'an calls Jesus as Massiah or Al-Masih. I do not know what the meaning of Christ is. But the meaning of Al-Masih which I get from Wikipedia is quoted below.
Dear Khalilur,
Once again I will respond as I did to the last time you asked if the Jews were anti-Christ.........
EVERYONE who rejects Christ is of the Spirit of anti-Christ.
This include you.
YOU have told me that Jesus is NOT the Christ! Do you realize that you said this?
KHALILUR RAHMAN
Your reply is again as confusing as your Gospel. You did not give any direct reply about Jews. I think you are afraid of admitting that the Jews are Anti-Christ because it may go against your interest or against the interest of Christian nations. However, it is absolutely true that the Jews are anti-Christ. Anybody have doubt on it, they have doubt on their own Bible.
Qur'an calls Jesus as Massiah or Al-Masih. I do not know what the meaning of Christ is. But the meaning of Al-Masih which I get from Wikipedia is quoted below.
"Masih
is the Arabic word for Messiah. In modern Arabic it is used as one of the many
titles of Isa ( ` s ), who is known to Christians as Jesus. Masih is used by
Arab Christians as well as Muslims, and is written as Yasu' al-Masih ( ) or Isa
al-Masih.
The word Masih literally means "The anointed one" and in Islam, Isa al-Masih is believed to have been anointed from birth by Allah with the specific task of being a prophet and a king. The Israelites, to whom Isa was sent, had a traditional practice of anointing their kings with oil. An Imam Bukhari Hadith describes Jesus as having wet hair that looked as if water was dripping from it, possibly meaning he was naturally anointed. Muslims believe that this is just one of the many signs that proves that Jesus is the Messiah.
In Islam, Isa is believed to hold the task of killing the false messiah (al-Dajjal, a figure similar to the Antichrist in Christianity), who will emerge shortly before him during Qiyamah (Armageddon in Islamic belief). After he has destroyed al-Dajjal, his final task will be to become leader of the Muslims. Isa will unify the Muslim Ummah (the followers of Islam) under the common purpose of worshipping Allah alone in pure Islam, thereby ending divisions and deviations by adherents. Mainstream Muslims believe that at that time Isa will dispel Christian and Jewish claims about him."
At 10:33 AM 6/16/2012, connect@godlife.com wrote:
Dear Khalilur,
I believe I did answer you directly. As I said, you and all those who embrace the Quar'an but reject the Bible are of the spirit of anti-Christ and you say so yourself! I am not judging you. I am saying this based on what you, yourself have said about Jesus.
By denying Him as the Christ (the savior of the world), who died to pay the price for the sins of the world. By denying Him, you are calling God a liar. How much more 'anti-Christ' can you get?
But just in case I was not clear:
Jews ARE anti-Christ, for the same reason.
Americans are anti-Christ for the same reason.
Buddhists are anti-Christ for the same reason.
Atheists are anti-Christ for the same reason,
and so and an so forth for everyone who denies that Jesus Christ, the Son of God has come in the flesh.
I can't say that those who have not heard are anti-Christ, but I can say anyone who has heard and then deny Him, are.
I don't think I could be much more direct.
OK, the Christ. Yes, Christ is the Greek for Messiah, the anointed One.
Here is a verse showing that messiah means Christ:
The woman said to Him, "I know that Messiah is coming" (who is called Christ). "When He comes, He will tell us all things." John 4:25
God does have various anointed ones. Kings were anointed, prophets, etc. Jesus, however was not just another anointed servant. He was the Son and as such is to be worshipped as God is worshipped.
The Muslim interpretation of Jesus is the mistaken one. I know you believe you follow God, but I must tell you in all love that you are following the teaching of men. If you loved God you would know that the words I tell you are from God.
The word Masih literally means "The anointed one" and in Islam, Isa al-Masih is believed to have been anointed from birth by Allah with the specific task of being a prophet and a king. The Israelites, to whom Isa was sent, had a traditional practice of anointing their kings with oil. An Imam Bukhari Hadith describes Jesus as having wet hair that looked as if water was dripping from it, possibly meaning he was naturally anointed. Muslims believe that this is just one of the many signs that proves that Jesus is the Messiah.
In Islam, Isa is believed to hold the task of killing the false messiah (al-Dajjal, a figure similar to the Antichrist in Christianity), who will emerge shortly before him during Qiyamah (Armageddon in Islamic belief). After he has destroyed al-Dajjal, his final task will be to become leader of the Muslims. Isa will unify the Muslim Ummah (the followers of Islam) under the common purpose of worshipping Allah alone in pure Islam, thereby ending divisions and deviations by adherents. Mainstream Muslims believe that at that time Isa will dispel Christian and Jewish claims about him."
At 10:33 AM 6/16/2012, connect@godlife.com wrote:
Dear Khalilur,
I believe I did answer you directly. As I said, you and all those who embrace the Quar'an but reject the Bible are of the spirit of anti-Christ and you say so yourself! I am not judging you. I am saying this based on what you, yourself have said about Jesus.
By denying Him as the Christ (the savior of the world), who died to pay the price for the sins of the world. By denying Him, you are calling God a liar. How much more 'anti-Christ' can you get?
But just in case I was not clear:
Jews ARE anti-Christ, for the same reason.
Americans are anti-Christ for the same reason.
Buddhists are anti-Christ for the same reason.
Atheists are anti-Christ for the same reason,
and so and an so forth for everyone who denies that Jesus Christ, the Son of God has come in the flesh.
I can't say that those who have not heard are anti-Christ, but I can say anyone who has heard and then deny Him, are.
I don't think I could be much more direct.
OK, the Christ. Yes, Christ is the Greek for Messiah, the anointed One.
Here is a verse showing that messiah means Christ:
The woman said to Him, "I know that Messiah is coming" (who is called Christ). "When He comes, He will tell us all things." John 4:25
God does have various anointed ones. Kings were anointed, prophets, etc. Jesus, however was not just another anointed servant. He was the Son and as such is to be worshipped as God is worshipped.
The Muslim interpretation of Jesus is the mistaken one. I know you believe you follow God, but I must tell you in all love that you are following the teaching of men. If you loved God you would know that the words I tell you are from God.
KHALILUR RAHMAN
I tell you again, you cannot reply a simple question in simple way. You try to twist it & make it generalized. When you say, Americans are anti-Christ, you have to prove it. When you say Muslims are anti-Christ, you have to prove it also. But for Jews, you do not need any proof. They are self-proclaimed anti-Christ from 2000 years back & they have not changed their position till today. You cannot generalize other Americans with Jews. I thought you have enough moral courage to accept this plain truth. But you have disappointed me.
I never said that we are anti-Christ. Muslims are the only & only nation in this world who believes on Jesus. We believe in his miraculous birth without a father, we believe on all his miracles, we believe he is a great messenger of God, we believe He is taken up alive; we believe He will come back again to rule the kingdom of God. But we do not worship him because he never said - " I am god & worship me". Rather he said:-
Mathew 4:10 - Worship the Lord your God, and only him. Serve him with absolute single-heartedness.
Mark 12:29-32 Jesus said Lord, our God, is one. And love him with allyour heart, life, mind & strength and love your neighbor. And they said -Yes, you are correct. There is no God except Him.
Even, when John saw the visions in Revelation, many times he wanted to worship Angels, but he was stopped straightway & told to worship God only. See these verses below :-
Rev 14:7 First Angel shouting to the people of earth, Fear God & proclaim His glory. Time has come for his judgment. Worship Him only Who has created the heaven & earth, Ocean & Springs.
Rev 19:10 When I wanted to worship that Angel, he said- Don’t do that. I am also a co-servant like you. Worship only God.
It is now very clear that we follow the command of Jesus by worshipping the ONE ONLY GOD Almighty.
We do not take the interpretation & concept of Paul which is misguiding the Christian world to Blasphemy.
You said that the Greek of Messiah is Christ which means Anointed one. But why you are translating it as "the saviour of the world" ? This is nowhere in Greek or in Aramaic or in Arabic.
At 04:21 AM
6/17/2012, connect@godlife.com wrote:
Dear
Khalilur,
It's not a
twist at all, you just don't like the truth. The truth is, the Bible is word of
God and therefore, it defines what the Spirit of Antichrist is, NOT YOU.
Look at the
verses, THESE ARE THE DEFINITION OF ANTI-CHRIST.
"Little
children, it is the last hour; and as you have heard that the Antichrist is
coming, even now many antichrists have come, by which we know that it is the
last hour." - (1Jo 2:18 NKJV)
"Who is
a liar but he who denies that Jesus is the Christ? He is antichrist who denies
the Father and the Son." - (1Jo 2:22 NKJV)
"and
every spirit that does not confess that Jesus Christ has come in the flesh is
not of God. And this is the spirit of the Antichrist, which you have heard was
coming, and is now already in the world." - (1Jo 4:3 NKJV)
KHALILUR
RAHMAN
My dear
friend, I did not ask you the definition of Anti-Christ. I asked you some
specific reply regarding Jews. I know you have technical problem for direct
reply. If you say, the Jews are Anti-Christ, then you may have to face the next
question- why you Christian nations are taking Jews as your intimate friend?
The reply will be very embarrassing for you. I don't want to put you on that
embarrassment. You don't have to reply. But if you think that you Christian
Nations, along with the Jews, will welcome Jesus on the mount of Zion, choice
is yours. But I am afraid that Jesus may reject you telling-
Mathew 7:21-23
- They will tell me , Lord, did not we
spell out the spirit on thy name! Did not we do miracles on Thy name? I will say I don’t know you,
Workers of un-righteousness. Go away.
KHALILUR
RAHMAN
As we know the Revelation is the prediction of future world which was seen by John in vision, I asked you whether there is any prediction about the rise & spread of Islam in this prediction. You replied negatively. But if you read Rev 6 very carefully & apply your wisdom, we find that it is there. Lamb was breaking the seals one after another & each time some new incident was occurring in this earth. When he ripped off first seal, it showed the first important occurrence to be happened in this earth.
Revelation 6:1-2 I watched while the Lamb ripped off the first of the seven seals. I heard one of the Animals roar, Come out! I looked & saw a white horse. Its rider carried a bow& was given a victory Crown. He rode off victorious, conquering right & left.
A man on a white horse, equipped with only bow as an important weapon, having the blessings of God, started spreading left & right as victorious. This is nothing but Islam. Rising of Islam is the only major development which first occurred in this world just after the departure of Jesus. Note the type of weapon. When Revelation described other incidents, it gave the descriptions of modern fire power. This is the only incident where very old type of weaponry like bow & sword have been used.. So, considering the time slot & weapon system & the consequences, we find that this verse refers to Islam.
As we know the Revelation is the prediction of future world which was seen by John in vision, I asked you whether there is any prediction about the rise & spread of Islam in this prediction. You replied negatively. But if you read Rev 6 very carefully & apply your wisdom, we find that it is there. Lamb was breaking the seals one after another & each time some new incident was occurring in this earth. When he ripped off first seal, it showed the first important occurrence to be happened in this earth.
Revelation 6:1-2 I watched while the Lamb ripped off the first of the seven seals. I heard one of the Animals roar, Come out! I looked & saw a white horse. Its rider carried a bow& was given a victory Crown. He rode off victorious, conquering right & left.
A man on a white horse, equipped with only bow as an important weapon, having the blessings of God, started spreading left & right as victorious. This is nothing but Islam. Rising of Islam is the only major development which first occurred in this world just after the departure of Jesus. Note the type of weapon. When Revelation described other incidents, it gave the descriptions of modern fire power. This is the only incident where very old type of weaponry like bow & sword have been used.. So, considering the time slot & weapon system & the consequences, we find that this verse refers to Islam.
At 09:26
AM 6/16/2012, connect@godlife.com wrote:
Dear
Khalilur,
You asked if I see or hear God.
God has most often spoken to me by direct revelation through my reading of the Scripture. In fact, the Bible says that 'faith comes from hearing and hearing comes from the word of God' and the word in the Greek interpreted 'word' of God, is Rhema which speaks of revelation, which is different from the word used in other areas of the Bible for word, such as 'logos', which speaks of the written word and also used in reference to Jesus.
So, God has spoken to me through His logos, by revealing (rehema) His mind in a matter.
I've had the Lord give me dreams about people and I have acted on those dreams and have seen Him perform small miracles for those people.
But mostly, He speaks to me (just about every day, if I take the time to listen!) through His Word. He reveals so much to me it's awesome.
KHALILUR RAHMAN
Now tell me something about your Holy Spirit. How do you meet him & communicate with him & how you learn new things from him. Does he give new lesson to all of you at the same time or each person gets independent lesson different from each other.. Please give me slight details.
You asked if I see or hear God.
God has most often spoken to me by direct revelation through my reading of the Scripture. In fact, the Bible says that 'faith comes from hearing and hearing comes from the word of God' and the word in the Greek interpreted 'word' of God, is Rhema which speaks of revelation, which is different from the word used in other areas of the Bible for word, such as 'logos', which speaks of the written word and also used in reference to Jesus.
So, God has spoken to me through His logos, by revealing (rehema) His mind in a matter.
I've had the Lord give me dreams about people and I have acted on those dreams and have seen Him perform small miracles for those people.
But mostly, He speaks to me (just about every day, if I take the time to listen!) through His Word. He reveals so much to me it's awesome.
KHALILUR RAHMAN
Now tell me something about your Holy Spirit. How do you meet him & communicate with him & how you learn new things from him. Does he give new lesson to all of you at the same time or each person gets independent lesson different from each other.. Please give me slight details.
At
01:03 AM 6/17/2012, connect@godlife.com wrote:
Dear Khalilur,
The Holy Spirit speaks to me in various ways and at various times. Sometimes through the Word of God as I read, He also speaks to me in my mind as I go about my normal day. He sometimes speaks to me as I listen at church. He never contradicts the bible and He often gives me multiple confirmations of the words He spoke. Sometimes those confirmations come through others telling me what the Lord has been showing them, and it lines up directly with what He spoke to me that day.
Other times He will speak something in my mind and then later that day I will read the exact verse He spoke to me and I wasn't even looking for that passage in the bible.
As a child of God, I have fellowship with others who are also born of God and we have the same mind it's called the mind of Christ and we very often hear the same message from the Holy Spirit even though we are not around each other and haven't spoken in weeks! It's truly miraculous
Dear Khalilur,
The Holy Spirit speaks to me in various ways and at various times. Sometimes through the Word of God as I read, He also speaks to me in my mind as I go about my normal day. He sometimes speaks to me as I listen at church. He never contradicts the bible and He often gives me multiple confirmations of the words He spoke. Sometimes those confirmations come through others telling me what the Lord has been showing them, and it lines up directly with what He spoke to me that day.
Other times He will speak something in my mind and then later that day I will read the exact verse He spoke to me and I wasn't even looking for that passage in the bible.
As a child of God, I have fellowship with others who are also born of God and we have the same mind it's called the mind of Christ and we very often hear the same message from the Holy Spirit even though we are not around each other and haven't spoken in weeks! It's truly miraculous
KHALILUR
RAHMAN
It seems that talking to God & talking to Holy Spirit is almost same. Can you differentiate whether this inspiration is coming from God or coming from Holy Spirit? This type of inspiration from God is called "Ilham" in Islam. But Inspiration may come from Devil also. So, a person should be very careful & should ask God to protect from Devil. In Islam, we measure the credibility of inspirations with the standard of Qur'an & Hadith. If it is contradictory to Qur'an & Hadith, it is to be avoided.
Do you see any visions & talk to Angels or Prophets or to God? Can you see the future in your visions? There is one sect in Islam which is called Sufism. They see the visions, talk to Angels & Prophets & sometimes to God. They travels in their visions & can see the future also. Many times they do miracles also. Main stream of Islam does not encourage it. This type of drill used to be performed in old days by Hindu & Buddha Saints also.
It seems that talking to God & talking to Holy Spirit is almost same. Can you differentiate whether this inspiration is coming from God or coming from Holy Spirit? This type of inspiration from God is called "Ilham" in Islam. But Inspiration may come from Devil also. So, a person should be very careful & should ask God to protect from Devil. In Islam, we measure the credibility of inspirations with the standard of Qur'an & Hadith. If it is contradictory to Qur'an & Hadith, it is to be avoided.
Do you see any visions & talk to Angels or Prophets or to God? Can you see the future in your visions? There is one sect in Islam which is called Sufism. They see the visions, talk to Angels & Prophets & sometimes to God. They travels in their visions & can see the future also. Many times they do miracles also. Main stream of Islam does not encourage it. This type of drill used to be performed in old days by Hindu & Buddha Saints also.
At 10:23 AM
6/17/2012, connect@godlife.com wrote:
Dear
Khalilur,
Yes, you are
correct. The Holy Spirit and God are the same person. So hearing from Him is the same as hearing
from God.
I am not a
believer in the Quar'annor the Hadiths. I am a believer in Jesus and the Bible.
I do not believe the Bible is corrupted nor do I believe that Jesus is a
created being. I have demonstrated that the Jesus of the Bible is not the Jesus
of Islam.
I understand
that people do hear from evil spirits. Because I am born again, that is, born
of the Spirit of God, I know that I am able to hear Him and cannot be tricked
by a demon. One way I can verify, is to compare what I hear with what the Word
of God (the Bible) teaches. But, because God Himself lives in me, I do not fear
that the Devil can overtake me through deception, for "greater is He who
is within me, then he who is in the world."
How can you,
yourself, be sure that the Quar'an and the Hadiths are from God? Do they agree 100% with the Bible, or do
their teachings abrogate what was given from God in the Bible?
KHALILUR
RAHMAN
Why you
don't believe in Qur'an & Hadith? But it is promised in Torah &Injil.
During the time of Jesus, Jews were waiting for three persons.. One is Elijah,
another is Messiah & the last one is that great Prophet for whom the whole
world was waiting.
John 1:20-21 -People asked John-Are you Masih, Elijah
or that Prophet?
We know that
Jesus is Messiah & John is Elijah. Now you have to find out who is that
Prophet who will come after Jesus. He is nobody but the Prophet of Islam.
During the emerge of Islam, Many Jews & Christian could recognize this
Prophet & they have accepted Islam.
Jesus also
informed about this Prophet & instructed his disciple to wait for him. He
said this in John.
John 14:15-17 - I will ask my father to send the
Comforter for you to stay with you forever.
But, Paul
has interpreted it wrongly & said it is Holy Spirit. I showed in my
previous mails that Holy Spirit was present from before the time of Jesus &
his disciples also received it before Jesus was taken up. So, this comforter is
other than Holy Spirit.
Old
Testament also predicted about this Prophet of Islam.
God said to
Abraham- "In your seed all the nations of the earth shall be blessed,
because you have obeyed My voice."" Gen 22:18 .
Please note
that The Prophet of Islam is carrying the seeds of Abraham through his first
born Ismail & he is sent for the whole Universe.
Deuteronomy 18:18 God said to
Moses I will raise a Prophet like you for them from their brethren & I will give my words to his mouth &
whatever I order him, he will pass on to them all.
A Prophet
like Moses will be raised , not from Jews, but from the Brethren of Jews, that
means from the Arabs, because Arabians are brothers of Jews. Paul claims that
it is about Jesus. But Jesus is not a man like Moses. Moses had father &
mother, but Jesus did not have father. Moses was married & had children,
but Jesus did not marry. Moses commanded
a nation, Jesus did not. There are many other dissimilarity between them. But
Prophet of Islam is just like Moses in all respect.
You asked
whether Qur'an believes 100% in Bible or not. Qur'an tells us to believe all
the scriptures of God. But it also says that they have made many corrections,
additions. Deletions & interpolations in both Torah &Injil. That is the
reason we find lot of contradictions in these two scriptures. You face real
difficulties to establish a fact because other verses are contradicting to it.
Qur'an does
not abrogate all of Torah &Injil. But this new Covenant is up-dated to make
suitable for all the people to come till doom's day.
At 06:06
AM 6/17/2012, connect@godlife.com wrote:
Dear Khalilur,
You say that Islam is the rider on the White Horse in Revelation 6: 1-2.
It says here that he went out 'conquering and to conquer'.
How is Islam conquering and who are they conquering?
KHALILUR RAHMAN
Don't you see that Islam is originated from Makkah& spread from Morocco in West to Indonesia in East. I did not find any other incidents which may fit in this slot of Revelation. Do you have any other idea?
Now let us move to the 7th chapter of Revelation. This chapter tells us who are the people will enter the heaven. All the servants of God has been sealed who will enter heaven. It shows that only 144,000 people, 12000 from each tribe of Israel, will enter heaven. Naturally, the remaining will go to hell.
Revelation 7:4 Then I counted the number of sealed Servants of God who will go to heaven. Only 144,000 were sealed from the tribe of Israel.
Now, when we proceed further & read Rev 7:9 & onward, we find that thousands of people dressed with white robe & date tree branches in their hands, waiting in front of God to enter heaven.
Revelation 7:9-17 Thousands of people from all nations & tribes, races & languages, dressed in white robes & waving palm ( date tree ) branches, assembled. They are countless in number. They all will enter heaven.
Now who are these people? Apply your wisdom. White robe & date tree branch, both are the symbols of Islam. You go anywhere in this world, you will find Muslims are putting white robes during all religious activities every day. And Date Tree is the national symbols of all nations in Middle East. So, there is no doubt that these countless waiting people are Muslims.
Dear Donald
I want to have some clarification on chapter 4 of Revelation. The whole chapter is dealing with the Throne of God & then 24 thrones encircled the throne of God.
Revelation 4:2-5 I saw a Throne set in Heaven with One seated on the Throne, suffused in gem hues of amber & flame with a nimbus of emerald. Twenty four thrones circled the Throne, with 24 Elders seated, white robed, gold crowned.
It is very much understood that the Central Throne belongs to God & God is sitting on it. But who are those 24 Elders with white robe & crowned sitting on thrones around God? And who are those 4 Animals around God, having eyes all around & always chanting praise to God.
Revelation 4:7 Prowling around the Throne were four Animals, all eyes. Eyes to look ahead, eyes to look behind.The first Animal like a lion, the second like an ox, the third with a human face, the fourth like an eagle in flight.
I think, the 24 Elders are 24 great Messengers of God whose names are mentioned in Qur'an. Four Animals may be the four great scriptures mentioned in Qur'an & sent by God. They are , Torah, Jabur, Injil& Qur'an.. If you have any other explanation, please let me know.
At 09:27 AM 6/20/2012, connect@godlife.com wrote:
Dear Khalilur,
Jesus explained at least 12 of those who sit on the thrones
Mat 19:28 So Jesus said to them, "Assuredly I say to you, that in the regeneration, when the Son of Man sits on the throne of His glory, you who have followed Me will also sit on twelve thrones, judging the twelve tribes of Israel.
Four living creatures are similar to what we see in Ezekiel 1and10, speaking of Cherubim. It is possible they are revealing to us how glorious God is, for they have eyes all around, as to say they see all things and what is their reaction to seeing so much of Gods creation? They continually worship God night and day! For He is worthy.
Face of a man , calf, lion and eagle: Exekiel 1:6 ( look it up ) these are Angels. Why these four faces? I'm not sure, it's up to interpretation. Perhaps speaking of tribes of Israel. But we really don't know. They could represent Jesus as depicted in the 4 gospels.
KHALILUR RAHMAN
I understand, you do not have any explanation of Revelation 4 which suits your Paulian concept. It is certainly not Jesus & his 12 disciples. Jesus will sit with his 12 disciples to judge the 12 tribes of Israel as shown in Mathew 19:28 . Note that Jesus judges only the people of Israel. He does not have any authority to judge other nations of the world.
There is another explanation also for Revelation 4. The central Throne is the Throne of the Prophet of Islam, because he is the leader of all the Prophets of God. Other 24 thrones around him is occupied by 24 great Prophets of God whose names are mentioned in Qur'an. Please note that the names of other Prophets are not mentioned in Qur'an although their numbers are much more than hundreds of thousands.
In your other mail you asked, who is teaching me, is it spirit of God? Certainly, I have Spirit of God in me & my living Guides are Qur'an & Hadith.
Now let us move to the chapter 12 of Revelation. This letter will be slight longer, because I want to present the whole of Revelation in one go. I hope you will read it in total.
Revelation 12:1-2 A great sign appeared in heaven. A woman dressed in sunshine, standing on moon & crowned with 12 stars was giving birth to a child.
Rev 12:5-6 The Woman gave birth to a Son who will rule all nations with iron hand. The son was placed safely before God. The Woman escaped to the desert.
A child is born in Middle East area who will rule all nations in iron hand. The boy is kept under safe custody of God so that nobody can kill him or harm him. We will see that this boy will appear in right time to fight the Dragon & Beasts. But the mother of this child which means the country he belongs to was in real danger. She was trying to escape the onslaught of the Dragon. Please see the next verses.
Rev 12:3-4 Then another sign, a huge & fiery Dragon. It had seven heads & ten horns. Heads are crowned.
Rev 12:9-10 The great Dragon , the ancient serpent , the one called Devil & Satan, the one who lead whole earth to astray, was thrown out to earth along with his angels.
Rev 12:13-17 The Dragon tried to catch that woman, but could not. The Dragon raged at the woman, then went to make war with the rest of her children who keep Gods command & give witness about Jesus. & then the Dragon waited on the shore of sea.
We must use our wisdom to understand these predictions of Revelation. The Dragon tried to catch the woman, but could not pinpoint her. So, it raged war against all people of this area. These people are righteous people who keep God's command & they give witness about Jesus also. Certainly these people are the Muslim population of Middle East. The Dragon is attacking them, destroying them & waiting on the sea shore to conduct next attack. The weapon used in these wars is having tremendous fire power. It is clear that the origin of this Dragon is not Middle East. It is coming across the sea & waiting on sea shore. Now use your wisdom to find out which is this country who is coming from across the sea , waging wars on the righteous people of Middle East & destroying the Middle Eastern countries one by one. Her identity will be clearly specified if you read the predictions of the French Priest Nostradamus of 15th century & see the movie " The Man Who Saw Tomorrow" made on his predictions. In that movie, it is clearly shown that the Dragon is USA. However, the prediction will be more clear if we can find out who is the Beast
Rev 13:1-2 I saw a Beast rising from the sea. It had ten horns & seven heads. Each horns is crowned, each head inscribed with blasphemous name.
Rev 13:3 The Dragon turned over its power, throne & great authority to this Beast.
Rev 13:4 The whole earth was astonished & followed the Beast. They worshipped the Dragon & worshipped the Beast.
Rev 13:7 The Beast was permitted to raise war on Gods holy people & conquer them. It held absolute authority over all tribes, countries, tongues & races.
Rev 17:10 These seven heads are seven kings also.
Rev 17:12 The ten horns you saw are ten kings as well.
If we analyze the above verses with wisdom, the identity of the Beast will also be clear. The Beast is also coming out of sea. So, it is originated from across the ocean like Dragon. Beast can use the power & authority of Dragon, it means the Beast & Dragon are helping each other. This Beast has got authority over all the countries of the world & it is using the huge power of Dragon. This Beast is authorized to raise war against any country of the World especially against Holy people of God & conquer them. Seven heads & 10 horns means seven big countries & another ten big countries are helping this Beast. Who is this Beast? It is clear that Beast is an World Organization like United Nations who is having authority over all the countries of the world. This Organization can wage war against any country of the world & USA is helping this organization with its fire power & authority. Sometimes USA is raising war in the name of this Organization. Now regarding 7 heads & 10 horns, it is 7 permanent members of Security Council & 10 temporary members of Security Council of UNO. Present UNO has only 5 permanent members. It means the present UNO still does not fulfill the Biblical prediction. But very soon they are going to have 2 more permanent members. As soon as it becomes 7 permanent members, the Biblical Prediction is going to be fulfilled. Please note that the Dragon & Beast will not be killed in the war of Armageddon. They will be captured & kept inoperative for next 1000 years. It means these two Institutions will remain there, only its beast & dragon like bad qualities will be removed. May be, Jesus will become the President of that new UNO& will have authority over all the countries of the world. Thus Jesus will become the King of the kings.
Rev 20:1-2 The Dragon & the Beast is kept captive for 1000 years so that they cannot misguide the people for 1000 years to come. After that they will be released again.
Now we will examine the identity of another beast which is coming out from the ground & having a number 666.
Rev 13:11-18 Second Beast coming out of the ground with two horns like a lamb., using the power of first beast, doing miracles, leading people to the wrong path & his number is 666.
Second Beast is originated from the ground of Middle East. It has two horns which means two big countries are helping this beast. It also use the power of first beast & leading people to the wrong path. It looks like a lamb. This is the catching point. Only the people of Israel are called lamb throughout the Bible. So, it is very clear that the second beast is the country of Israel. It is getting helps from two big countries of the world. It is using the power of USA & UNO to materialize its plan in Middle East. Regarding number 666, if we take the Hebrew/Aramaic spelling of Tribe Israel & use Aramaic Numerology, it will come out as 666. The most important point is that the Jews are always Anti-Christ during the life time of Jesus till today. So, anybody, any nations or any countries that joins Israel in the war of Armageddon will fall in the category of Anti-Christ & they will be defeated. Bible says, two third population of Israel will be killed in this war & remaining one third will accept Jesus after this war.
At this stage, God will send that Son who was born in the Middle East & kept under the protection of God. Dragon, two beasts & other kings will assemble to fight this man. Nobody knew the actual name of this man. In Islam, he is called Imam Mahdi which is a Title given to him.
Rev 19:11-14 Then I saw Heaven wide open & a white horse with his rider. The Rider, named Faithful & True, judges & makes war in pure righteousness.-- -He is followed by soldiers of heaven.
Rev 19:19 I saw the Beast & other kings assembled to fight this man on horse. First & second Beasts were caught & thrown to the lake of fire & all of their followers were killed.
At this stage Jesus also landed to earth & waiting in the mount of Zion with his 144,000 followers/soldiers.
Rev 14:1 Then I saw the Lamb standing on mount Zion with his 144,000 followers.
Rev 16:14 The Dragon, the Beast & the Second Beast collected all the kings of the world to fight on that great day of God.
Rev 16:21 From sky, huge stones weighing tons was dropping on man. They were dangerous.
The final war of Armageddon was a devastating war using all types of modern weaponry including nuclear, biological & chemical weapons. Both Bible & Hadith gives a detail descriptions how the Anti-Christ & his partners will be defeated. After the war, Jesus will take over the power of this world. Remaining Jews will accept Jesus. The misguided Christian people will come back to truth & follow Islam with Jesus. The first major incidents during this time will be the occasion when Jesus will get married. Those who will be invited in this marriage will be the lucky persons.
Rev 19:8-9 The marriage of Lamb has come. His wife has made herself ready. She was given a bridal gown of bright & shining linen. The linen is the righteousness. The Angel said to me-Write this, blessed are those invited to the Wedding Supper of the Lamb".
Islam says, Jesus will rule the nations for 40 years. He will have some children also. After that he will die a natural death. His righteous Caliph will take over the power & rule the kingdom of God. This type of righteous rule will continue for 1000 years. After that, the Beast & Dragon will reappear again & peace of this world will gradually disappear as well.
Dear Khalilur,
You say that Islam is the rider on the White Horse in Revelation 6: 1-2.
It says here that he went out 'conquering and to conquer'.
How is Islam conquering and who are they conquering?
KHALILUR RAHMAN
Don't you see that Islam is originated from Makkah& spread from Morocco in West to Indonesia in East. I did not find any other incidents which may fit in this slot of Revelation. Do you have any other idea?
Now let us move to the 7th chapter of Revelation. This chapter tells us who are the people will enter the heaven. All the servants of God has been sealed who will enter heaven. It shows that only 144,000 people, 12000 from each tribe of Israel, will enter heaven. Naturally, the remaining will go to hell.
Revelation 7:4 Then I counted the number of sealed Servants of God who will go to heaven. Only 144,000 were sealed from the tribe of Israel.
Now, when we proceed further & read Rev 7:9 & onward, we find that thousands of people dressed with white robe & date tree branches in their hands, waiting in front of God to enter heaven.
Revelation 7:9-17 Thousands of people from all nations & tribes, races & languages, dressed in white robes & waving palm ( date tree ) branches, assembled. They are countless in number. They all will enter heaven.
Now who are these people? Apply your wisdom. White robe & date tree branch, both are the symbols of Islam. You go anywhere in this world, you will find Muslims are putting white robes during all religious activities every day. And Date Tree is the national symbols of all nations in Middle East. So, there is no doubt that these countless waiting people are Muslims.
Dear Donald
I want to have some clarification on chapter 4 of Revelation. The whole chapter is dealing with the Throne of God & then 24 thrones encircled the throne of God.
Revelation 4:2-5 I saw a Throne set in Heaven with One seated on the Throne, suffused in gem hues of amber & flame with a nimbus of emerald. Twenty four thrones circled the Throne, with 24 Elders seated, white robed, gold crowned.
It is very much understood that the Central Throne belongs to God & God is sitting on it. But who are those 24 Elders with white robe & crowned sitting on thrones around God? And who are those 4 Animals around God, having eyes all around & always chanting praise to God.
Revelation 4:7 Prowling around the Throne were four Animals, all eyes. Eyes to look ahead, eyes to look behind.The first Animal like a lion, the second like an ox, the third with a human face, the fourth like an eagle in flight.
I think, the 24 Elders are 24 great Messengers of God whose names are mentioned in Qur'an. Four Animals may be the four great scriptures mentioned in Qur'an & sent by God. They are , Torah, Jabur, Injil& Qur'an.. If you have any other explanation, please let me know.
At 09:27 AM 6/20/2012, connect@godlife.com wrote:
Dear Khalilur,
Jesus explained at least 12 of those who sit on the thrones
Mat 19:28 So Jesus said to them, "Assuredly I say to you, that in the regeneration, when the Son of Man sits on the throne of His glory, you who have followed Me will also sit on twelve thrones, judging the twelve tribes of Israel.
Four living creatures are similar to what we see in Ezekiel 1and10, speaking of Cherubim. It is possible they are revealing to us how glorious God is, for they have eyes all around, as to say they see all things and what is their reaction to seeing so much of Gods creation? They continually worship God night and day! For He is worthy.
Face of a man , calf, lion and eagle: Exekiel 1:6 ( look it up ) these are Angels. Why these four faces? I'm not sure, it's up to interpretation. Perhaps speaking of tribes of Israel. But we really don't know. They could represent Jesus as depicted in the 4 gospels.
KHALILUR RAHMAN
I understand, you do not have any explanation of Revelation 4 which suits your Paulian concept. It is certainly not Jesus & his 12 disciples. Jesus will sit with his 12 disciples to judge the 12 tribes of Israel as shown in Mathew 19:28 . Note that Jesus judges only the people of Israel. He does not have any authority to judge other nations of the world.
There is another explanation also for Revelation 4. The central Throne is the Throne of the Prophet of Islam, because he is the leader of all the Prophets of God. Other 24 thrones around him is occupied by 24 great Prophets of God whose names are mentioned in Qur'an. Please note that the names of other Prophets are not mentioned in Qur'an although their numbers are much more than hundreds of thousands.
In your other mail you asked, who is teaching me, is it spirit of God? Certainly, I have Spirit of God in me & my living Guides are Qur'an & Hadith.
Now let us move to the chapter 12 of Revelation. This letter will be slight longer, because I want to present the whole of Revelation in one go. I hope you will read it in total.
Revelation 12:1-2 A great sign appeared in heaven. A woman dressed in sunshine, standing on moon & crowned with 12 stars was giving birth to a child.
Rev 12:5-6 The Woman gave birth to a Son who will rule all nations with iron hand. The son was placed safely before God. The Woman escaped to the desert.
A child is born in Middle East area who will rule all nations in iron hand. The boy is kept under safe custody of God so that nobody can kill him or harm him. We will see that this boy will appear in right time to fight the Dragon & Beasts. But the mother of this child which means the country he belongs to was in real danger. She was trying to escape the onslaught of the Dragon. Please see the next verses.
Rev 12:3-4 Then another sign, a huge & fiery Dragon. It had seven heads & ten horns. Heads are crowned.
Rev 12:9-10 The great Dragon , the ancient serpent , the one called Devil & Satan, the one who lead whole earth to astray, was thrown out to earth along with his angels.
Rev 12:13-17 The Dragon tried to catch that woman, but could not. The Dragon raged at the woman, then went to make war with the rest of her children who keep Gods command & give witness about Jesus. & then the Dragon waited on the shore of sea.
We must use our wisdom to understand these predictions of Revelation. The Dragon tried to catch the woman, but could not pinpoint her. So, it raged war against all people of this area. These people are righteous people who keep God's command & they give witness about Jesus also. Certainly these people are the Muslim population of Middle East. The Dragon is attacking them, destroying them & waiting on the sea shore to conduct next attack. The weapon used in these wars is having tremendous fire power. It is clear that the origin of this Dragon is not Middle East. It is coming across the sea & waiting on sea shore. Now use your wisdom to find out which is this country who is coming from across the sea , waging wars on the righteous people of Middle East & destroying the Middle Eastern countries one by one. Her identity will be clearly specified if you read the predictions of the French Priest Nostradamus of 15th century & see the movie " The Man Who Saw Tomorrow" made on his predictions. In that movie, it is clearly shown that the Dragon is USA. However, the prediction will be more clear if we can find out who is the Beast
Rev 13:1-2 I saw a Beast rising from the sea. It had ten horns & seven heads. Each horns is crowned, each head inscribed with blasphemous name.
Rev 13:3 The Dragon turned over its power, throne & great authority to this Beast.
Rev 13:4 The whole earth was astonished & followed the Beast. They worshipped the Dragon & worshipped the Beast.
Rev 13:7 The Beast was permitted to raise war on Gods holy people & conquer them. It held absolute authority over all tribes, countries, tongues & races.
Rev 17:10 These seven heads are seven kings also.
Rev 17:12 The ten horns you saw are ten kings as well.
If we analyze the above verses with wisdom, the identity of the Beast will also be clear. The Beast is also coming out of sea. So, it is originated from across the ocean like Dragon. Beast can use the power & authority of Dragon, it means the Beast & Dragon are helping each other. This Beast has got authority over all the countries of the world & it is using the huge power of Dragon. This Beast is authorized to raise war against any country of the World especially against Holy people of God & conquer them. Seven heads & 10 horns means seven big countries & another ten big countries are helping this Beast. Who is this Beast? It is clear that Beast is an World Organization like United Nations who is having authority over all the countries of the world. This Organization can wage war against any country of the world & USA is helping this organization with its fire power & authority. Sometimes USA is raising war in the name of this Organization. Now regarding 7 heads & 10 horns, it is 7 permanent members of Security Council & 10 temporary members of Security Council of UNO. Present UNO has only 5 permanent members. It means the present UNO still does not fulfill the Biblical prediction. But very soon they are going to have 2 more permanent members. As soon as it becomes 7 permanent members, the Biblical Prediction is going to be fulfilled. Please note that the Dragon & Beast will not be killed in the war of Armageddon. They will be captured & kept inoperative for next 1000 years. It means these two Institutions will remain there, only its beast & dragon like bad qualities will be removed. May be, Jesus will become the President of that new UNO& will have authority over all the countries of the world. Thus Jesus will become the King of the kings.
Rev 20:1-2 The Dragon & the Beast is kept captive for 1000 years so that they cannot misguide the people for 1000 years to come. After that they will be released again.
Now we will examine the identity of another beast which is coming out from the ground & having a number 666.
Rev 13:11-18 Second Beast coming out of the ground with two horns like a lamb., using the power of first beast, doing miracles, leading people to the wrong path & his number is 666.
Second Beast is originated from the ground of Middle East. It has two horns which means two big countries are helping this beast. It also use the power of first beast & leading people to the wrong path. It looks like a lamb. This is the catching point. Only the people of Israel are called lamb throughout the Bible. So, it is very clear that the second beast is the country of Israel. It is getting helps from two big countries of the world. It is using the power of USA & UNO to materialize its plan in Middle East. Regarding number 666, if we take the Hebrew/Aramaic spelling of Tribe Israel & use Aramaic Numerology, it will come out as 666. The most important point is that the Jews are always Anti-Christ during the life time of Jesus till today. So, anybody, any nations or any countries that joins Israel in the war of Armageddon will fall in the category of Anti-Christ & they will be defeated. Bible says, two third population of Israel will be killed in this war & remaining one third will accept Jesus after this war.
At this stage, God will send that Son who was born in the Middle East & kept under the protection of God. Dragon, two beasts & other kings will assemble to fight this man. Nobody knew the actual name of this man. In Islam, he is called Imam Mahdi which is a Title given to him.
Rev 19:11-14 Then I saw Heaven wide open & a white horse with his rider. The Rider, named Faithful & True, judges & makes war in pure righteousness.-- -He is followed by soldiers of heaven.
Rev 19:19 I saw the Beast & other kings assembled to fight this man on horse. First & second Beasts were caught & thrown to the lake of fire & all of their followers were killed.
At this stage Jesus also landed to earth & waiting in the mount of Zion with his 144,000 followers/soldiers.
Rev 14:1 Then I saw the Lamb standing on mount Zion with his 144,000 followers.
Rev 16:14 The Dragon, the Beast & the Second Beast collected all the kings of the world to fight on that great day of God.
Rev 16:21 From sky, huge stones weighing tons was dropping on man. They were dangerous.
The final war of Armageddon was a devastating war using all types of modern weaponry including nuclear, biological & chemical weapons. Both Bible & Hadith gives a detail descriptions how the Anti-Christ & his partners will be defeated. After the war, Jesus will take over the power of this world. Remaining Jews will accept Jesus. The misguided Christian people will come back to truth & follow Islam with Jesus. The first major incidents during this time will be the occasion when Jesus will get married. Those who will be invited in this marriage will be the lucky persons.
Rev 19:8-9 The marriage of Lamb has come. His wife has made herself ready. She was given a bridal gown of bright & shining linen. The linen is the righteousness. The Angel said to me-Write this, blessed are those invited to the Wedding Supper of the Lamb".
Islam says, Jesus will rule the nations for 40 years. He will have some children also. After that he will die a natural death. His righteous Caliph will take over the power & rule the kingdom of God. This type of righteous rule will continue for 1000 years. After that, the Beast & Dragon will reappear again & peace of this world will gradually disappear as well.
At 10:22
AM 6/20/2012, connect@godlife.com wrote:
Dear Khalilur,
All of your claims about who Jesus is are simply incorrect and based on false teaching. Sorry to be so blunt. Once you know the truth the opposite is easy to spot.
You claim that Islam is the true way of God and that Jesus is not the Son of God and that He did not die to take away the sins of the world, that Jesus did not die on the cross but swooned, you claim that the Bible was corrupted over the years and that you have the new, restored scriptures in the Quar'an and the Hadiths. You believe yours is the only true religion before God.
You are not alone in these claims......
Jehovah's witnesses claim that they are following God in truth, that the bible was corrupted but their teachers have now rightly interpreted it and that Jesus did not rise from the dead physically, but spiritually only and that Jesus was not God in the flesh, but rather He was Michael the arch angel. they believe that theirs is the only true church.
Mormons claim that God appeared to Joseph Smith and told him that all churches were an abomination and had gone astray and that you cannot understand the bible without the book of Mormon, and their other book the doctrine and covenants. They do not believe that Jesus is God in the flesh and in fact they believe that Jesus and Lucifer were spirit brothers, but Lucifer got made and caused a rebellion in heaven when Jesus said He would come to earth and teach people about the Father, rather than to force them to submit to God. They believe that theirs is the only true church.
I claim that Jesus is exactly who the Bible claims Him to be and that the Injil as you call it, was not corrupted, but is in fact the inerrant Word of God ( And just as Jesus said, heaven and earth shall pass away but not His word will never fail'.)
KHALILUR RAHMAN
Dear Khalilur,
All of your claims about who Jesus is are simply incorrect and based on false teaching. Sorry to be so blunt. Once you know the truth the opposite is easy to spot.
You claim that Islam is the true way of God and that Jesus is not the Son of God and that He did not die to take away the sins of the world, that Jesus did not die on the cross but swooned, you claim that the Bible was corrupted over the years and that you have the new, restored scriptures in the Quar'an and the Hadiths. You believe yours is the only true religion before God.
You are not alone in these claims......
Jehovah's witnesses claim that they are following God in truth, that the bible was corrupted but their teachers have now rightly interpreted it and that Jesus did not rise from the dead physically, but spiritually only and that Jesus was not God in the flesh, but rather He was Michael the arch angel. they believe that theirs is the only true church.
Mormons claim that God appeared to Joseph Smith and told him that all churches were an abomination and had gone astray and that you cannot understand the bible without the book of Mormon, and their other book the doctrine and covenants. They do not believe that Jesus is God in the flesh and in fact they believe that Jesus and Lucifer were spirit brothers, but Lucifer got made and caused a rebellion in heaven when Jesus said He would come to earth and teach people about the Father, rather than to force them to submit to God. They believe that theirs is the only true church.
I claim that Jesus is exactly who the Bible claims Him to be and that the Injil as you call it, was not corrupted, but is in fact the inerrant Word of God ( And just as Jesus said, heaven and earth shall pass away but not His word will never fail'.)
KHALILUR RAHMAN
Now
everybody is claiming that he is correct. How you will find out who is
correct? Qur'an says-" Bring your proof to support your claim (
HatuBorhanakum )". You have to examine what is the basis of his claim,
you have to examine his scripture. To defy my claim, you have to study my
scripture & tell me the reason of your disbelief. But I have made it very
easy for you. I never quoted from Qur'an. All quotations I have given from your
Bible & proved that:
1. Son does not carry the sin of father
2. Nobody can pay for other's sin, you have to pay for your sin
3. Jesus is not a begotten son of God, he does not carry the seed of God. He is called son of God as all other believers are also called son of God.
4. Jesus is sent only for the tribe of Israel.
5. Jesus did not come to destroy the Law and commandments of Moses, but to strengthen them.
6. He will send a Comforter/ Helper/ Counselor/ Advocate to his man to teach everything which he could not say.
7. This Comforter is not Holy Spirit; it is another Prophet for whom the Jews are still waiting.
8. Jesus did not die on cross. He was senseless & given treatment in his grave.
9. The present Christians are not following Jesus, but they follow the concept of Paul.
9A. Paul was not a disciple of Jesus. Two disciples of Jesus were supporting him at the beginning, but they abandoned him. Paul sailed alone.
10. 144,000 Jews from 12 tribes will go to heaven & thousands of uncountable Muslims are going to heaven. There is no proof that any Christian is going to heaven.
11. Predictions show that USA is Dragon, UNO is the Beast & Israel is the second beast with number 666.
12. The boy who was born in Middle East will appear & fight the Dragon & two Beasts.
13. Jesus will come down & join this boy to fight the Dragon & Beasts.
14. The Dragon & Beast will be captured & kept captive for 1000 years. After that they will re-appear again.
15. Jesus will rule the nations.
16. Jesus will marry & have children & die a natural death after 40 years.
17. Final Judgment will be done by God alone. Nobody shares this authority. Everybody will be judged for his deeds only.
1. Son does not carry the sin of father
2. Nobody can pay for other's sin, you have to pay for your sin
3. Jesus is not a begotten son of God, he does not carry the seed of God. He is called son of God as all other believers are also called son of God.
4. Jesus is sent only for the tribe of Israel.
5. Jesus did not come to destroy the Law and commandments of Moses, but to strengthen them.
6. He will send a Comforter/ Helper/ Counselor/ Advocate to his man to teach everything which he could not say.
7. This Comforter is not Holy Spirit; it is another Prophet for whom the Jews are still waiting.
8. Jesus did not die on cross. He was senseless & given treatment in his grave.
9. The present Christians are not following Jesus, but they follow the concept of Paul.
9A. Paul was not a disciple of Jesus. Two disciples of Jesus were supporting him at the beginning, but they abandoned him. Paul sailed alone.
10. 144,000 Jews from 12 tribes will go to heaven & thousands of uncountable Muslims are going to heaven. There is no proof that any Christian is going to heaven.
11. Predictions show that USA is Dragon, UNO is the Beast & Israel is the second beast with number 666.
12. The boy who was born in Middle East will appear & fight the Dragon & two Beasts.
13. Jesus will come down & join this boy to fight the Dragon & Beasts.
14. The Dragon & Beast will be captured & kept captive for 1000 years. After that they will re-appear again.
15. Jesus will rule the nations.
16. Jesus will marry & have children & die a natural death after 40 years.
17. Final Judgment will be done by God alone. Nobody shares this authority. Everybody will be judged for his deeds only.
KHALILUR
RAHMAN
The discussion on Revelation cannot be completed if we do not say something about last judgment. Verses from Rev 20:11-15 deals the whole process of final Judgment. Please read the following verses.
Rev:20:11-12 I saw a Great White Throne & One sitting on that. All assembled in front of that Throne------Judgment was made as per deeds of the person.
Rev 20:14 everybody was judged as per his deeds.
If we read the whole chapter on Judgment, we find that God almighty was sitting on a big White Throne. All people assembled in front of him for taking judgment. Some books were opened & judgment is delivered as per their deeds written in their books. Everybody was judged as per his deeds. There was no exceptions. Please note that the exclusive authority of judgment was with God Almighty. No body shares this authority. Hadith says, even the Prophets & Messengers of God will be asked about their followers.
God will ask Jesus also. Qur'an says-- And behold! Allah will say; "oh Jesus the son of Mary, didst thou say unto men, ' Take me and my mother for two gods beside Allah'?" He will say; - " Glory to Thee! never could I say what I had no right ( to say ). Had I said such a thing, Thou wouldst indeed have known it. Thou knowest what is in my heart, though I know not what in Thine. For Thou knowest in full all that is hidden. " Never said I to them aught except what Thou didst command me to say, to wit, Worship Allah, my Lord & your Lord'; and I was a witness over them whilst I dwelt amongst them; when Thou didst take me up Thou wast the watcher over them; and Thou art a witness to all things. Qur'an 5:116-117)
The discussion on Revelation cannot be completed if we do not say something about last judgment. Verses from Rev 20:11-15 deals the whole process of final Judgment. Please read the following verses.
Rev:20:11-12 I saw a Great White Throne & One sitting on that. All assembled in front of that Throne------Judgment was made as per deeds of the person.
Rev 20:14 everybody was judged as per his deeds.
If we read the whole chapter on Judgment, we find that God almighty was sitting on a big White Throne. All people assembled in front of him for taking judgment. Some books were opened & judgment is delivered as per their deeds written in their books. Everybody was judged as per his deeds. There was no exceptions. Please note that the exclusive authority of judgment was with God Almighty. No body shares this authority. Hadith says, even the Prophets & Messengers of God will be asked about their followers.
God will ask Jesus also. Qur'an says-- And behold! Allah will say; "oh Jesus the son of Mary, didst thou say unto men, ' Take me and my mother for two gods beside Allah'?" He will say; - " Glory to Thee! never could I say what I had no right ( to say ). Had I said such a thing, Thou wouldst indeed have known it. Thou knowest what is in my heart, though I know not what in Thine. For Thou knowest in full all that is hidden. " Never said I to them aught except what Thou didst command me to say, to wit, Worship Allah, my Lord & your Lord'; and I was a witness over them whilst I dwelt amongst them; when Thou didst take me up Thou wast the watcher over them; and Thou art a witness to all things. Qur'an 5:116-117)
At 09:53
AM 6/23/2012, connect@godlife.com wrote:
Dear
Khalilur,
Perhaps the Hindu's religion had a shade of some truth in that they recognized the tri-unity of God? Why is it that Christianity is copying some other religion?
Isn't is at least possible that even false religions have some points of truth to them?
So, the Trinity is in deed the real godhead, but the Way to know that God still remains a mystery to some such as
Hindu's, Buddhists and Islamists, for they seek to achieve acceptance by God through their own efforts, rather than accept His free gift of redemption motivated by His love for them.
KHALILUR RAHMAN
I sent about 3 mails on Revelation. If you have any comments on those, please send them to me.
Perhaps the Hindu's religion had a shade of some truth in that they recognized the tri-unity of God? Why is it that Christianity is copying some other religion?
Isn't is at least possible that even false religions have some points of truth to them?
So, the Trinity is in deed the real godhead, but the Way to know that God still remains a mystery to some such as
Hindu's, Buddhists and Islamists, for they seek to achieve acceptance by God through their own efforts, rather than accept His free gift of redemption motivated by His love for them.
KHALILUR RAHMAN
I sent about 3 mails on Revelation. If you have any comments on those, please send them to me.
At 11:32 AM
6/22/2012, connect@godlife.com wrote
Dear
Khalilur,
You keep quoting the Bible in parts, but ignoring the items that do not agree with your beliefs.
Like this one written in my previous email:
The rest of your assessment of the Book of Revelation has no merit, for you ignore the veracity of the Scripture. You cannothave it both ways.
Either the ENTIRE Bible is the Word of God, or none of it is.
KHALILUR RAHMAN
The verses that I quoted from Bible does go against your belief, but they are in favour of my belief. This is the proof that the verses of Bible are contradicting each other. It means some of them are true & some of them are not true. Verses coming from God are true; and man-made verses are confusing or not true. You said in your last mail that there may be some trace of truth in a false religion like Hindu. It seems that it is also true for Paulian religion also. Some traces of truth is there, but the basis of faith is wrong.
The explanations & study I made on Revelation are based on the verses of Revelation. If they go against your belief, I cannot help it. Truth must be exposed & you should have moral courage to accept the truth.
At 11:32 AM 6/23/2012, connect@godlife.com wrote:
Dear Khalilur,
I'm sorry to say that I have nothing to say. You have won your war. By ignoring completely every single scripture I have sentthat corrects your mistaken claims to what the Bible says, you have sealed your fate.
You deny the veracity of all scripture and lay claim to have a full understanding of that which you sayis not true. It is either fitting logic or dishonestly, I cannot say for I am not God.
Your arguments to dismiss the Biblical Jesus are weak and unsubstantiated at best and worse, they are more the thing of denial.
Farewell.
KHALILUR RAHMAN
It is not a matter of winning a war or winning a Jihad. It is a matter of exposing the real truth to the people. I have tried to find out the real truth from your own scripture. Many thanks for your help & support in this regard. I would not have learned so much about your scripture without your help & support.
You will not understand what my religion can give you unless you study Qur'an & Hadith or you discuss with any Muslim about it. Any time you intend to do so, I will very cordially help you.
You need both faith & deeds for salvation. You will be judged both by faith & deeds. Again I can quote a verse from Revelation. Rev 20:14 Everybody was judged as per his deeds. May Allah swt may guide us to real truth.
Best Regards
KhalilurRahman
You keep quoting the Bible in parts, but ignoring the items that do not agree with your beliefs.
Like this one written in my previous email:
The rest of your assessment of the Book of Revelation has no merit, for you ignore the veracity of the Scripture. You cannothave it both ways.
Either the ENTIRE Bible is the Word of God, or none of it is.
KHALILUR RAHMAN
The verses that I quoted from Bible does go against your belief, but they are in favour of my belief. This is the proof that the verses of Bible are contradicting each other. It means some of them are true & some of them are not true. Verses coming from God are true; and man-made verses are confusing or not true. You said in your last mail that there may be some trace of truth in a false religion like Hindu. It seems that it is also true for Paulian religion also. Some traces of truth is there, but the basis of faith is wrong.
The explanations & study I made on Revelation are based on the verses of Revelation. If they go against your belief, I cannot help it. Truth must be exposed & you should have moral courage to accept the truth.
At 11:32 AM 6/23/2012, connect@godlife.com wrote:
Dear Khalilur,
I'm sorry to say that I have nothing to say. You have won your war. By ignoring completely every single scripture I have sentthat corrects your mistaken claims to what the Bible says, you have sealed your fate.
You deny the veracity of all scripture and lay claim to have a full understanding of that which you sayis not true. It is either fitting logic or dishonestly, I cannot say for I am not God.
Your arguments to dismiss the Biblical Jesus are weak and unsubstantiated at best and worse, they are more the thing of denial.
Farewell.
KHALILUR RAHMAN
It is not a matter of winning a war or winning a Jihad. It is a matter of exposing the real truth to the people. I have tried to find out the real truth from your own scripture. Many thanks for your help & support in this regard. I would not have learned so much about your scripture without your help & support.
You will not understand what my religion can give you unless you study Qur'an & Hadith or you discuss with any Muslim about it. Any time you intend to do so, I will very cordially help you.
You need both faith & deeds for salvation. You will be judged both by faith & deeds. Again I can quote a verse from Revelation. Rev 20:14 Everybody was judged as per his deeds. May Allah swt may guide us to real truth.
Best Regards
KhalilurRahman
HERE ENDS PART-II
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